how about something elanor-ish set up to give just enough bump to clear the blower?

 

Ok, I need to get a bigger mid-pipe. After being under the car, I realized how restrictive the stock one is. What would be the best choice of mid-pipe? An H-Pipe or X-Pipe? Keep in mind, I'm trying to plan this all along with the 5.4 swap. I'm going to get headers eventually too, and do that all at the same time when I swap in the new K-Member and Engine. I recall either custom headers or shorties being the only option for proper fitment correct? Can anyone recommend a specific brand or type? Thanks!

 

well, like many of those before me who have contemplated the lightning swap...ive come to realize that its not gonna happen. after hours of running numbers, figures, and different setups ive decided that its just going to probably end up costing more than i want to spend. especially when i have to get a new tranny and mad suspension work to even get it to hook up with that ungodly amount of torque.

back to the drawing board...which i am happy to say includes the 5.4

ive figured that with what i want to do the limits of my 4.6 are about 435-450rwhp...im afraid this might not get me to my goals. the 5.4 being the better platform that it is ive decided to go with a fully built 5.4, forged internals, stage 3 ported PI heads (off my stang), a nasty set of cams, all the exhaust and intake work i can do...im trying to get to 400-425 N/A...and then hook up my zex kit and spray a 150 shot for a total of "hopefully" 550-575hp or roughly 470ish to the wheels


i think that might get me into the 11s

 

Hey just to let you guys know SaleenS330 (Travis) no longer has his Saleen w/ the 5.4. He sold it and now has a 05 GT. He never really cared for the convertible and decided to get rid of it.

 

maybe he'll do a 5.4 swap into the new stang...

 

myillwillinc,

what kind of hp/tq numbers were you putting down with the 5.4 and the mods in your sig??

im trying to get an idea of the hp achieved with full bolt-ons

thanks

 

i never got to the dyno with it. from a 20mph kick, i beat a 99 cobra with x-pipe and flowmasters fairly easy. maybe that will help

 

wow... so much new stuff. The news about Travis wounds me. He'd just finished putting mad money into it and now it's gone. Burn.T

Siwelk... depending on where you live you'll want to make sure you can pass emissions with the setup you want. For a real nitrous breating monster that's streetable, try for 11:1 compression, .030 overbore, stage 3 ported heads, HPS intake and XE278 cams. The heads will restrict your power a bit but the stage 3 port and cams will really help.

I'd use a 2.5" H pipe. X pipes are harder to widen but a good H-pipe is only a spacer away from fitting and it's pretty easy to add width that way.

We've got dyno numbers from a couple cars. So far they've turned in from 240-289hp and 330-375tq at the wheels depending on mods and tune. With the 5.4 things like a 75MM TB and cams and ported heads become proper options instead of well oversized like on the 4.6's.

For aftermarket headers, only FRPP shorties fit without tagging the steering shaft. Plan accordingly.

 

yeah, that helps illwill, thats pretty good. those cobras are at 320 stock, he might have been up to 330 or so...im guessing you had around 350+. its good to know that the 5.4s respond well to bolt ons. im hoping i can go from 300 to 425 N/A on this block. with full bolt ons and stage 3 heads and cams do you think i can pick up the 125hp ill need?


thanks r3dn3ck, i live in Indiana and we dont have **** for emissions. ive been trying to decide what CR would be best. i was thinkin about maybe 10:1 just in case i happen to stumble on a used centrifugal at a really good price. id hate to build up a high compression nitrous motor and have to pass on a deal on a procharger or vortech. i found a nice kit w/ mahle pistons/rings and forged H beam rods with ARP bolts for $840 but it was geared toward the lightning and the pistons were dished for a 9.2:1 CR...which is probably too low for nitrous right?

ill tell you my goals and what i want to get out of this block in the long run, that way you can help me out as im comin along. you seem to be the resident expert on this topic r3dn3ck and i appreciate any help and insight you can provide.

im basically looking for a "streetable" beast. once im done itll probably be more of a weekend warrior type deal. like my thursday, friday, saturday nite ride. anyways my long term goals are mid 11s or better w/ at least 475rwhp.
thats what i would like to achieve in the long run. im hoping to build the motor up N/A to about 425hp and spray 100-125 shot for fun, and 150-175 at the track. ive already got my zex kit and thats why i love the juice cause you can have a mean lil thing that has 425hp for the street and then go to the track and flip a switch and be at 600.

anyways, 11s and 500rwhp would be my ultimate goal here. sorry for the long post, just thought id let you in on what i want to do here so you can offer the best help.

thanks!

 

well, i just got home after workin 3rd shift until 7am and school from 930 - 200 so im gonna *** out...ill see whats happenin on here before work tonight.

later fellas

 

stop worrying about HP numbers. They don't tell you the whole story. HP is a measure of gas burned and work done. Actual power is TQ and that's what we're building. Having 300hp and no tq means a slow car with a motor that spins super high RPM. Having 300tq and little hp means a low rpm car that can shove you in the back pretty hard. Shoot for 10:1 compression and you limit your boost potential to 5-6lbs without race gas. Drop the compression to 9.5:1 and you can shoot in maybe 12lbs or so. Problem is blowers are always on. Nitrous is only on when you want it on.

For mid-high 11's, 9.5:1 compression on a mild build (stock cams maybe) and 125 shot and you should have the power to get there. Just a stock 5.4 will land you in the mid to high 12's.

For a good deal on pistons and rods call up my boys at TMD and get the Probe -4.5cc dish (for 10.1:1 on stock PI heads) slugs with perfect circle file fit rings (I'd get an overbore if you're buying a used block), and a set of their forged H beams. Don't forget rod and main bearings, probably in a .010 under size and ARP main studs and head bolts. Rods are 319, pistons are a tad over 500 normally. Ask for john and tell him Colin Burns sent you. 909-369-0200

 

right on man, thanks. i just ordered my block yesterday. it was 460 new from 50resto.com

and im not worried about hp numbers, id just like to see 475-500 at my wheels. my goal is 500rwhp and mid 11s...if i can, id like to see both. but you know, its whatever

if im going with an aggressive build, i.e. stage 3 ported PI heads, and a pretty wild cam, what CR should i shoot for? 9.5:1, 10:1, 11:1?

what would be best

 

I'd go as high as you're able to support. If you seriously want boost then stay at 9.5:1. That's about what it is from the factory. I'm doing 10.5:1 and a shot of nitrous with mild cams. Get std bore pistons since you have a new block. No need for an overbore... just costs more to get it machined. When you're ready for a blower, drop in 10-12lbs of boost and watch things get exciting. With boost you'll definitely be able to see 500hp and well in excess of that in tq. Add a 100 shot of giggle gas and you'll be just plain silly fast.

 

$460 new for a 5.4 shortblock? I went to that 50resto.com site, I don't see any of those. Was this a special deal? Let me know man!

Edit: I mean "bare block".

Also r3dn3ck, would it be smarter to go with a new bare block instead of a used shortblock even though it may cost a bit more since I plan on getting all forged internals anyway and it would save me from having to get it machined?

 

not a short block... just a bare block. Still a good price for a brand spanking new block.

 

Oh sweet, I found this Ford Racing 5.4 block...... looky looky:

http://www.modulardepot.com/product_...roducts_id=259

 

cool, i guess ill shoot for 10:1. that way i can go up or down .5 if i decide to

 

this may be a little off topic but i was just checking out the Eaton M112 blowers (stock on lightnings and terminator cobras). would it be possible to use the lower intake from a 5.4 lightning and a blower off of a cobra? i know the cobras a dohc 4.6 but if the blowers are the same would it fit? im only asking cause i know that the cobra blowers have a side exit for the intake/TB whereas the lightnings is on the top. i thought maybe if this worked it might solve the hood clearance issues by shaving off 3" or so.


just a thought...

 

I'd thought of that but I haven't had any lightning lowers to test 03 blower fitment against. It'd probably be easier to just slap a centrifugal on it though.

 

the supercharger would fit the manifold, or the elbow into the back of the supercharger could be interchanged, so you could get a complete lightning setup and just swap the elbow. The next ? would be would the lower manifold fit a 2V head, since the SVT lightning is a 4V. You would probably be better off looking for an F150 kit and swaping out the elbow. An elbow for the cobra also accomodates either stock or upgraded dual blade throttle bodies or Accufab also makes a polished high flow big oval single blade.

 

Umm, if i'm not mistaken, the Lightning engine is nothing more than a 5.4 2v Engine with forged lower end / crank, maybe a slightly beefier block depending on year comparisons, and a blower slapped on top.

 

lightning and SC'd Harley models are 2V motors, not a 4V. Only the GT supercar and GT500 use a 4V supercharged motor from the factory.

The blower cases have the entry cast into them so you can't just pull off the back section...you'd have to swap blower cases. Nonetheless, if the cobra blower will fit the lightning manifold, then you're set and we'll all be buying cobra blowers and lightning lowers.

My next poost is the cool one...

 

Lightning was a 2V so the lower manifold should fit. The problem then is whether the 03 Cobra blower fits and hood clearence.

 

You beat me to the punch man.

 

2001 Lightning Specifications

ENGINE
Configuration Longitudinally mounted, single overhead cam, 90-degree Triton? V-8 supercharged/intercooled, cast iron block, aluminum-alloy heads, forged steel crankshaft
Bore x Stroke 90mm x 105.6mm
Displacement 5,410cc (330cid)
Compression ratio 8.4:1
Horsepower 380 hp @ 4,750 rpm
Torque 450 lb.-ft. @ 3,250 rpm
Specific output 70.2 horsepower per liter
Redline 5,250 rpm (fuel shut-off @ 5,400 rpm)
Valvetrain Single overhead camshafts, chain drive, roller finger followers with hydraulic lash adjustment, beehive valve springs, two valves per cylinder
Intake valves 1 per cylinder, 44.5mm head diameter
Exhaust valves 1 per cylinder, 36mm head diameter
Fuel system Sequential electronic fuel injection, premium calibration
Induction system Pressure-charged with Eaton? Corporation Generation IV Roots-type supercharger; water-to-air intercooler
Supercharger 8.0 psi pressure
Throttle body Dual-bore 57mm
Mass-air sensor 90mm diameter
Exhaust manifolds Cast-iron tuned header-style manifold
Exhaust system Tuned dual exhaust, ceramic-coated dual exhaust tips

 

now like I was saying... This is pretty cool. I was getting all my parts together to make a box for my engine builder and decided to do a little photo shoot.

There's a few bits still on the way then it's off to machining and assembly. I didn't include either intake manifold cuz one is unavailable right now and the other is holding my mockup motor together.

 

Perfect Circle rings, Probe pistons, TMD Rods, Sealed Power rod bearings, Speed Pro main bearings, ARP main studs, FRPP windage tray, Vortech 255LPH fuel pump, ARP crank bolt, Reichard Racing adapter plates, comp valve springs.

Let's see cost.... about 1700 bucks in actual cash spent on those parts. Considering that I'm a helluva good bargain hunter... that's not too bad. Retail cost would have added about 500 bucks.

 

oops, you got me. I guess only lincoln used the 5.4 4V, I thought SVT just had a thing for DOHC. Soooooo.... lightning intake should work. Now you got me double checking myself. I believe the eaton can interchange elbows. I know the Kenne Bell can not. Lemme see what Eaton says...

OK, so Eatons site isn't helpful, and I would suggest being carefull buying used superchargers on e-bay, looks like some people feel they don't need to include all of the supercharger. that's where I found the "universal" M90 with no inlet port.

 

r3dn3ck, you should slap together some 5.4 build kits and sell them as a package, I know I would buy one if it saved me time and money. Nice parts btw, it reminds me of when I get ready to build a computer and lay all the parts out all nice like.

 

I thought Ford said their windage doesn't fit Windsor style blocks...