when i put the first 5.4 in i didn't notice the front end sitting any lower. i think it is about 75lbs heavier then a 4.6. i have a PA racing tubular k-member to put in mine for this time around. right now i have the rearend out and i am putting factory five racing upper and lower control arms plus i just put a 255lph fuel pump in also. i had put the battery in the trunk already also, the taylor kit is the best one for doing that.

- if you want a 31 spline rearend for cheap, find a f-150 2wd or explorer with an 8.8 rear, alot of them came with factory 31 spline chunks. all you would need is the axles. i am gonna goto the junkyard this weekend to pick thru some truck rears...

 

4.6 and 5.4 Weights
Engine Type Weight
4.6 SOHC 500 lbs
4.6 DOHC 425 lbs (al. block)
5.4 SOHC 525 lbs
5.4 DOHC 540 lbs



Engine Dimensions
Engine Height Depth Width
4.6 SOHC 26" 23 5/8" 26 5/8"
4.6 DOHC 27 1/8" 23 5/8" 26 5/8"
5.4 SOHC 28" 23 5/8" 27"
5.4 DOHC 35 1/2" 23 5/8" 28 1/4"

 

That's the specs that i had on the weight of the motors, but i know on a engine stand, the 4.6 longblock sloped a tad and the 5.4 sloped it alot more. I can't see 25lbs making it slope like that or making my cars front fenders almost sit on the tires. I would think 75lbs also.
but if it is definitely 25lbs more, the tubular k member is suppose to drop 25-28lbs, so it's a must to me. i'll have to check on the Taylor battery kit.

 

sick info. thanks a gob for posting it.

I might just stick with my 350# front springs. they're kinda at the limit of streetability with the 4.6. Perhaps a little extra weight will calm down the ride a bit.

 

I know one thing though, weighing 25pds or 75pds more...I would do the swap 100X's, the 5.4 should have been an option for mustangs years ago. The TQ is to sweet to pass up. not to include a pretty easy swap.

 

The 5.4 should tame those springs, but still be a nice ride.

 

I'm hoping so. I have a set of 375's but that's like having a 1500lb conventional spring and I don't really want to use them. Those are for racing and they're NOT comfortable on the street. Hell my 350's make it ride pretty rough over the little bumps.

 

According to the FRPP catalog, the 5.4 block weights 30 lbs more than the 4.6 (pre 2002) while the post 2002 blocks weights 45 lbs more. Considering that both engines have all the same parts (except crank, connecting rods, timing cover, and manifold), a 5.4L engine should weight in at about 30-45 lbs more than a 4.6L engine.

 

wow, why are the SOHC only a 2" difference but the DOHC about 8"? That leaves some serious hood clearance issues for someone like me or the guy with the Mach 1 that wanted to keep his shaker scoop.:bash: What happened to the discussion on the engine lowering kit?

 

I remember that in '00 w/ the Cobra R, Ford made mounts to lower the engine I believe about an inch. Since it was a production vehicle (though limited), I bet you can go to your local dealer and even order them. If you can order all the special parts from the Bullitt Mustang (gauge cluster, pedals, etc.), I wouldn't be surprised if you can order the mounts as well. Has anyone tried to order these mounts through Ford?

 

you can order them thru some ford dealers but also remember that your oil pan will sit an inch lower also. if your car is lowered then it's something to consider.

 

the 4V 5.4L intakes are largely designed for truck use (except the 00' R) and so hood clearance isn't an issue with those.

On a semi related note: At one time I'd found a company in Australia that makes 4V 5.4L intakes for use with low hooded cars like the Falcon and its progeny (I was looking for 5.4L 2v intakes). Getting one here would be fantastically expensive on shipping but otherwise not too bad on base cost. It's a whole new integration nightmare too.

This brings up a point... don't forget that Aussie Fords exist and are usually higher performing than US models. They have the luxury of being given the opportunity to own things like the GT&GT-P.

Lowering the engine mounting point requires other changes when distances reach beyond about a half inch. I've been trying to figure out a way to make it work with MM but we're in need of some measurements and kinda limited on how big the spacers can be.

 

when ordering a tubular k-member, some companies will put the motor mounts up to 2 inches lower. you just will need to make the adjustment for everything else to match that. i just got a cowl hood to makeup for the spacers and was done with it.

 

there are limits to how far you can lower the motor mounts. to do so you'll also have to reset the tranny mounts with some spacers and depending on how far you go you may have to adjust the pinion angle. The 4.6 already sits just about 1" off the k-member so there's a little room but not enough to do much.

In any case, it looks like we've got measurements for K-member spacers that will allow the bulk of any hood cutting with RR or similar plates and standard GT height intakes to be eliminated. It's still a case by case thing but we're figuring .3" should allow us to eliminate most if not all hood cutting on stock 99-04 hoods. 96-98 hoods it'll help but there will almost certainly be a little bit of cutting.

The ugly part is even if you get the hood to close, there still has to be room for it to torque around or you may end up with some damage or wear.

 

I just want to figure out a way to fit long tubes on it. With out spending a crap load.

 

try bassani mid-length. they have to be welded together to start with so they're easier to install in that respect than pre-welded units. once you've got them in then you'll have to spend a couple hundred on custom welding of bits and pieces to make it fit.

If you really want it bad, the way I'd go is buy a cheap mig welder, learn to weld well enough to butt weld pipes (easy easy easy easy) and get to work cutting and welding your own pipes. It's not really hard but it does require your car to be down for a few days normally while you fit everything.

Lemme put in a call to a couple exhaust manufacturers and see what I can get done. Maybe an enterprising company will be down with making at least a base kit that can be custom welded into place.

 

That would be sweet. I will deal with that when the time comes.

 

FRPP shorty headers are decent... they're not longtubes but they're 50 state smog legal and better than the cast iron manifolds.

 

Yeah but i want the power from the long tubes but i think i'll try the bassani mid lengths and if they don't work then i'll resell and get some shorties.

 

Hi -

We have a beatup and tired '96 Ford Crown Vic. The poor thing, its been hit a few times (lightly), its paint is beatup, the 4.6L burns oil pretty bad and the transmission is going.

Its not worth trading it and I rather make a project out of it than donate it.

Since the engine needs to be rebuilt or replaced, I figured a '03 or later Mustang GT 4.6L would be the ticket. But then I thought, hey all the modular engines should fit, if you willing to put up with some re-wiring, in the case of 2V cars being converted to 4V cars.

I read alot of the thread here and I think I have the list of parts I need.

But I do have some questions -

Saleen hit 289hp/366tq and I feel that would be enough to "move" the Vic into the mid 13's if equiped with M/T ET Streets, Built Tranny with mild converter and 3.27 final drive.

We're on a limited budget, but I'm thinking converting it to '04 spec interior and exterior wise, Maurder Front bumper, along with Kenny Brown/PI/Maurder suspension, new paint and 20" American Racing wheels (20x10 in the rear, 20x8.5 in the front).

What kind of power could I expect from 5.4L short block, '01 or later GT heads (unported), Bullit Intake, Pulley, CAI, Shorties, PI dual exhaust (Dynomax piping) with Ultra-Flow mufflers?

We might hit it with nitrous.... My Pop used to run nitrous on a small Chevy powered Chevy C/K shortbed, loved it. Only this would be faster by quite a bit I feel...

Any suggestions on the rebuilding of the tranny? Stock converter or mild converter?

Nice to find a board were everybody is postive about the 5.4L swap and not negative like so many other Mustang or Modular boards seem to be about the swap.

 

Hey man welcome to the site. It is definitely possible to do the swap but Saleen's numbers are with Stage 2 ported Patriot heads so that's about a 30 to 40 hp increase over stock pi heads. If you are going to do the build up i would definitely look into ported and polished heads too. Also i would probably go with a better than stock converter and look into a C4 trans or building a 4r70w. I'm sure the experts will chime in soon and get you started in the right direction. Good luck with everything and keep us posted.

 

chime...

depending on the weight of the vic you should be lodged firmly in mid 13's with slicks but I'd put a set of 3.55 or 3.73 gears in due to the vehicle weight instead of 3.27s.

Do not use nitrous on a stock bottom end 5.4. You'll ventilate the block. The stock rods are great for mild bolt-on applications but power adders are a no-no in my book until you have forged performance rods in it.

There's no limit to the power you can get from a 5.4. The blocks are nearly indestructible. I'd estimate your power with a good tune at 250/375 wtih the build you posted.

For a converter, look at one with a moderate stall like 2400-2800rpm as that's where the torque will begin to peak. It'll be at full tq by 3500rpm. You'll want to use either a built C4 or a 4R70W or a 4R75W(best).

My motor will see nitrous now and then and with the build I'm doing I can reasonably use as much as a 200 shot if it's progressively added. Otherwise, it'll just blow the tires off and wreck me.

Staying 2V will limit peak performance but it's pretty easy to do and no slouch in its own right. Add nitrous and things even out really really fast.

My suggestion would be to stretch the time out a little so the budget grows, buy a set of good forged pistons and H-beam rods, port the heads, get a bigger cam like a XE262AH (street/strip) or a XE270AH (more strip, less street), use 3.73 gears and a 26" E/T tire. You should be able to use enough nitrous to get that thing into the low 12's or even high 11's and it'll still drink pump gas and behave on the street.

I'm up in norcal but I pass through Reseda pretty often when I go to see the family around Riverside. When you get your build going, let me know... I'd love to see it.


now that's how to ramble

 

Yeah what he said! LOL.

 

Well i hate to say this to r3dn3ck but i just got my pistons. I know you've been waiting a while i got mine in 3 days. The only problem is my wife didn't know i ordered them now she does and i think she is going to kill me. :wallbash: I'm excited i have them now though. I will take pics later.

 

<voice=cartman> going to kill you guys ... seriously</voice>

Calling TMD now to find out what's up.

 

Good luck bro!

The build up time is getting closer...

 

Well just wanted to let you guys know i survived my wife and it's all good now. Next time I wont make the same mistake.

I'm definitely excited about the build up. I still need to get the main bearings and rod bearings, also i want to get the ARP main stud bolts. I will probably be taking my block in the next month or so to get machined and my crank too. So those are my updates.

 

congrats on surviving. I know the feeling.

I called up TMD and found out my pistons are due to come in in the next week or two. It would seem that since my order was back ordered to start with, it's still on the bottom of the list. TT330's wasn't back ordered so he got them right away. Awww Ballz!

Such is life. I still have 300 to spend on ARP stuff, and another 200 to spend on gaskets.

 

Yeah i got lucky. That's only the stuff i need for the short block my parts list is still really long.

 

i just picked up a 98 expedition front cover for $35 now i need to test my 2 procharger brackets to make sure they fit...

i am getting there...slowly but surely