I currently have a full exhaust, K&N FIPK, and a Pro 5.0 shifter. I plan on doing 3.90's, U/D pulley's, and the Accufab Throttlebody and upper intake plenum, and a SCT tune. Are there any other bolt on's i can do to get my car running constant 12's?

 

sorry dude...but i dont think that you'll run 12's with the mods that you have done. Probly mid 13's....if you have anything less than a 99 get a pi head/intake swap

 

Nitrous would really help.

 

I'd like to keep it N/A for as long as possible, would Stage 1 cams be a decent upgrade with a stock bottom end?

 

mid 13's? are you serious? my car with nothing but intake,off road h-pipe,mac pro dumps and drag radials goes mid 13's.

He should be in the 12's with his mods and some traction.

and the only other easy bolt on would be an e-water pump.

next up would be a set of cams for you and a good tune.

 

Definitely. If you go with anything more agressive, you must change the valve springs as well.

Add the cams to your list and you should be in the 12s or damn close with good driving.

 

Built rear, slicks, and I think you got 12's covered. If you want em, Im serious, build your rear end with 31 spline stuff when you get the 3.90s. That way, you can launch it as hard as you could ever want, and not be worrying about it.

 

You can run 12's on a complete stock motor, BUT it takes lots of practise and the right suspension setup and good tires. Power is not everything. One of the moderators here has 2002 Automatic running 12.8's and the motor is 100% stock....no power adder either.

He has, LT's, UDP, TB, Plenum, X-pipe, Catback, converter, tune, slicks, and adjustable shocks if I recall. But the slush box runs 12.8.

 

and 4.30 gears blake.

 

I don't how much it will help(because not many people have done it) but I'm about to get the aluminum driveshaft, that's about the only thing I can think of, and it is possible to run 12's, I don't even have headers, or DR/slicks and run a corrected 13.1

 

There not that much to practice on an automatic - specially with out laughing gas. The lights arn't that complicated - well maybe i your color blind. Anyway yes, GT's with cat back exhaust (manuals ) are capable of low-mid 13's otherwise stock. With your mods -p.s. you should go with 4.10's, alot faster especially farther down the aftermarket road -DONT FEAR THE GEAR- you should be able to run high 12's easily - an aluminum fly wheel and or axle will most likely slow you down at this point - as you are losing intertia. Later with forced induction these mods will be benifical. Your next step should be LONG TUBE headers if you don't already have them - better than the gear in my opinion for power and of course sound. realisticly though a S/C is need to be low 12's and low-mid 11's with a stock motor (depending on boost & brand) -procharger if you want to run low 11's on a stock motor. Don;t be afaird of power adders either - nos has alot of research to be done inorder for it to be "right" and is much more expensive than the systems you see most people running - direct port is what you want if your going to setup nos right. A supercharger is the best way to go bar-none - its totaly safe at 8lbs and very safe at 10lbs (intercooled) past that you need to build that sucker. Alot of people here don't know what they are talking about and for all you know I could be one of them - do your own research and find the facts for yourself before you do anything! - good luck

 

Problem is, there are a lot of ways to get to 12's. And if you want to stay n/a, it is just that much harder.

You can spend $4000 grand easy on n/a mods and get there, or just throw on a huffer for the same price and get there with just one saturday's worth of work.

BUT, don't ever loose sight of suspension mods. Traction and weight transfer is what any drag racer needs. Thing is though, the more you rely on suspension mods to make your car go fast, the harder it is to drive in a circle. This is why blowers are so apealing to me. You can make the car quick, but keep all the drivability.

Also, one other thing. Do you want a car designed to just run the 1/4 mile, or one that has top-end speed. You can easily make a nice 12.8 second n/a car, but get beat on the streets by SRT's from a 40 mph roll. This si where nitrous or a blower comes in.

Case in point. My car (though I have not sprayed at the track yet) should be every bit a high 12 second car, right? Dean has an 2002 automatic that is n/a all the way and he runs a 12.8. If we were to race, he would rape my **** off the line and prolly get a good lead on me even if we started at the exact same time. We might both cross the line 12.8 seconds later, but I might do it at 115 mph and he does it at 108 mph. Make sense?

 

not really to me -im nt sure why he would be faster- if you have a manuel and you have an auto with the same mods - you should smoke his a$$ out the hole.

 

You missed my point...sorry.

I was trying to illustrate in a real world situation two cars that are totally different. Keep in mind, the auto runs on slicks and has a converter on it. The car is also setup with a drag suspension. My car has street tires and a stiff suspension....better for the twisties. He has 4.30's...I have 4.10's.

I make prolly 75 - 80 more hp then he does on the spray...maybe more. With the two cars side by side, he will beat me out of the hole, but I should be able catch up. We get to the end of the 1/4 at about the same time and since I make more power, I have a faster trap.

 

another point to consider; noting your mod list, is that you haven't taken care of building a foundation to run 12's all day on. Take this from someone that made the same mistake a couple times...

You need to build the parts of your car that you're going to torture. Specifically, 28 spline axles are alright. I've only known a couple guys to twist/break them running low 12's and high 11's. The stock diff is not alright. Auburn makes a fine diff that you'll have a hard time busticating. Might as well cuz' you're going to want to do the gears for the improvement of everyday driving in 5th gear (pick your own damn ratio). I liked 3.55's a helluva lot. You have the option of slapping in 31 spline axles which isn't a bad idea but again not totally necessary.

Brakes. Get better than stock. Stock stang brakes even suck for stock brakes. Cobra kit's for the front are a bargain at about 400 bones. Easy, cheap, fantastic mod and it really fills out the wheels a lot better for the bling factor. Rear brakes don't matter just yet. Leave em alone.

Clutch. You're going to blow up the stock clutch. Get something a tad more oriented to having the pedal sidestepped at 4000+RPM.

Realize that tranny damage is a possibility and plan accordingly.

I don't personally know anyone that's gone 12's with less than P&P heads and/or hotter cams on top of a full exhaust and good suspension. Maybe if you lighten the hell out of the car. Doesn't matter to me. Fact of the matter is that it takes a certain amount of power to move a 3600lb thingy down range in a particular amount of time. You can't escape it, it's basic physics.

My calculator shows that you should expect to be making 378 flywheel hp to see 12.98 @ 103.7 for a 3600lb object. If you drop the weight to 3300lbs you only need 346 flywheel hp to do exactly the same thing. This proves the 100lbs/.1sec rule. Drop one hundred from the weight you drop one tenth from the et. Coil overs and tubular this and thats really drop weight from your car fast. Get the good stuff. Don't cheap out or you'll regret it. Remove whatever ain't nailed down. Replace the front seats with something like a Corbeau Forza, you'll see about an 80lb weight drop right there. Bounce the back seat entirely, and you're over 100lbs dropped. Say hello to .1sec of reduced et.

 

mattJ is at 13.5 with exhaust, chip, and 3.90's. With 4.10's and all the bells and whistles(headers, tb/plenum, pullies,etc) I see no reason why you cant run 12's, as long as you have slicks or dr's

 

Huh?? My car weighs 3270 and runs 12.61@109mph with an automatic leaving the line at 1500rpm. 100%stock rear suspension. 100% stock longblock(aftermarket cams)I ran 12's with 247rwhp. Its not that difficult. All this 4000rpm lauches etc is unneccesary. I cut 1.70 60's without flashing the converter...think about that.

 

you have a built rear i guess and slicks correct? thats something most people wont do sadly.

 

Redneck:

You make some good points. I would beware those calculators as they never seem to translate into real world, but still a decent basis to follow.

Regarding your point about building up the driveline, fact is, I don't race much. If I am lucky I get out 1 to 2 times per year. Last season, I did not go at all. My theory on rear end and clutch is that I will replace it when it brakes. If I were racing all the time, I might change my position just to avoid a tow home. I also run on street tires which helped reduce the abuse on the rear end. From my research, 4.10's+Slicks=broken rear end. Having a power adder with slicks is that much tougher. But I know plenty of guys running many trips down the strip on stock rear ends. It is only a matter of time before it brakes. Maybe 10 runs...maybe a 100 runs. But it will go.

 

I was addresing TruBlu02 in general.. not anyone else in particular in case there was any confusion. The advice is for the n3wb not you gomers with experience and skillz.

Yes I know the calculators aren't exact due to a lot of factors but they are a serious reality check.

From my point of view, at least drag radials if not et streets are drag strip attire. Street tires don't belong there, not nearly enough traction for my taste.

4K launches are not uncommon with manual trans guys, especially those running slicks. Stock suspension isn't really that bad.. pull the front swaybar and have fun but better is still lots better.

I don't know about the rest of you guys but I like to kick my pony once in a while on the street (when noone is around and it's safe) just for fun. That's why I bought the car. Doing so requires that I can steer and stop at high speed just like normal driving, and that nothing breaks at a critical moment. So I have cobra brakes, rockin' MM suspension, built rear end, just now changing to a t56 after blowing my 3rd 3650 in really aggressive STREET DRIVING, and just for giggles, tossing in a built 5.4 to blow it all up again sometime this spring.

12.6's on 247rwhp tells me someone was using nitrous (not an accusation, just can't see it happening). But I can't reconcile the 109 trap speed. It should be closer to 300 rwhp to see anywhere near that trap or et. So, good work to modmotoracerdude... ya beat newton. Torque production must be impressive on your combo... do tell what did those cams do for you.

Race hard on anything and it'll give... just how long you have is the question. I don't like waiting till it breaks. God hates me and curses me at every turn. I try not to give him many ways to fack up my day, particularly my ride home.

 

Trap speed is a real measure of hp. Trapping at 109 with 247 rwhp in a Mustang tells me that either the dyno was wrong, the car was spinning a lot at launch, or there is a lot of weight pulled.

 

Its more of a power to weight measure you mean, but yeah he is right on it.

 

horsepower is a measure of work, not power as in force. Force is measured as torque which is kinda funny if you think about the application of all these terms... (torque being the tendency to turn) they're just a tad off their meanings in common usage. 1hp (FWIR) is the amount of work or energy that has to be created to lift 33,000 pounds a height of one foot in one minute of time or to overcome or create a force which is equivalent to doing that amount of work. That's about 550lbs being lifted 1 foot every second. Seems like a lot but 550lbs ain't much, 1 second is a really long time in terms of measuring energy transfer, and 1 foot ain't far at all.

Thus, spike and MT's#... are both correct and someone trapping 109 ain't got just 247rwhp... well actually yes, if you have 335+rwtq (just a really torquey motor like a 5.4 2V) with that 247hp, then you could easily trap that high at have ET's that low. I'm swapping to a 5.4 for that very reason.

 

Well if you re-read my post it doesn't say i ran 12.61@109 with 247, it says I ran 12's with 247. Which I did...12.92. But after that I added LT headers and Accufab TB/Plenum(bought here ) and ran the 12.61. My car weighed 3270lbs, it was a 1.70 60' the DA was 1000ft. If you think that isn't possible then wait till I run 12.5x with the exact same combo. I would guess i have about 260rwhp now and somewhere in the 285-290rwtq ( I had 247/271 before). I have all my slips, and the entire Joliet crowd at the 2005 NMRA event this year as my witnesses. I am trying to make the point that its not that hard to get into the 12's. And my rear besides the 4:10's is 100%stock also.

 

Ok, I'm in kind of a similar boat. I'm finishing up the enigne with the remaining bolt ons, Tb/Plenum and U/D pulleys along with a 2800 Stall Convertor and 4.10 gears. I was talked into this by my personal tuner. Should be around 265RWHP (it is an *AUTO*). I have no clue what I'll run but was guessing around 13.5. My car is a daily driver and wouldnt mind putting some good suspension work into it. What about this package from maximum motorsports? http://www.maximummotorsports.com/giab3.asp What else could I do to help? I will be on street tires, but brand new BFG's. Again, it is a daily driver but would like for it to be, well *FUN*

 

If your car weighs anywhere around 3270 and you run a similar 60' you should be in the same ET range I am.