View Poll Results: What are your 5.4L swap plans?
Voters: 220. You may not vote on this poll
Anyone intrested in 5.4L swaps, in here. Need you to opine.
#241
05-01-2006, 10:25 AM
Yeah i know the stock 2V 5.4 can only take 450 HP to the wheels and anymore, you have to mess with the internals. We'll besides a brake light problem, the car is done. Rob from Pro-dyno, Charlotte NC,
came down with a chip and tuned it there in the carport. He messed with several things to get me by till i go there in 2 weeks to get a dyno/tune. And i knew and he knew it has alot more potential but....man...we kept doing second gear runs so he could check things out and all i have to say is....HARD...it's pulls soooo freak'n hard and when the stage 2 heads take over up top, it's then pulls harder. With some cams and that 5.4 intake, it will be awesome. This 5.4 can't touch my 4.6 that i had, not even close.
came down with a chip and tuned it there in the carport. He messed with several things to get me by till i go there in 2 weeks to get a dyno/tune. And i knew and he knew it has alot more potential but....man...we kept doing second gear runs so he could check things out and all i have to say is....HARD...it's pulls soooo freak'n hard and when the stage 2 heads take over up top, it's then pulls harder. With some cams and that 5.4 intake, it will be awesome. This 5.4 can't touch my 4.6 that i had, not even close.
#242
05-01-2006, 11:21 AM
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Magrathea/California
Posts: 9,865
kick azz. Take some video of your speedo on a 4th gear run. I'm sure that'll be enlightening.
I'm itching to start the rebuild on mine. 10:1 with XE268's and a port job and forged rods and pistons. Then I'll put the nitrous kit back in and jet it for 75hp. That should yield acceptable performance.
I'm itching to start the rebuild on mine. 10:1 with XE268's and a port job and forged rods and pistons. Then I'll put the nitrous kit back in and jet it for 75hp. That should yield acceptable performance.
#243
05-01-2006, 11:37 AM
Originally Posted by 97_Cobra_Droptop
A little on/off topic here. As you can see by my name I have a 4V currently. Would I be correct in assuming I could swap in a 4V 5.4L with the wiring harness, maybe extend some wires, does anyone know if that's roughly the same degree of dificulty/simplicity, with the exception of cost effecientcy. Other than that, I love the 2V discussion. I prefer the improved look for 99 and wanted a 99-04 GT for a 650+ Kenne Bell project car that would be street legal with the exception of no cats. But with the added torque of a 5.4L? I'm a little torque crazy, and this would not be a daily driver, nor cost effective, but with the 97, especially being a convertible, a little more torque wouldn't hurt. I was thinking Kenne Bell kit at 9 PSI (+108HP/98lbs TQ at wheels). Either way I go, I don't hold a lot of faith in the T45, so a T5 and alum drive shaft would go in first.
Back to 2V. With the people talking 5.4 + Kenne Bell, since everything is compressed and their exceding the $2500 mark anyway, wouln't the 5.4 factory intake and Kenne Bell 5.4 kit (6 PSI rated) with a pulley change for added boost be safer if only slightly less efficient then a 4.6 manifold with RR adaptor plates? I just see it as one more leak waiting to happen in a forced induction situation, and with air compressed throughout the manifold anyway, you would just want bigger valves and cam grind to let it in the cylinder. For NA, however, I would definately take the plates until the Hardballr comes out.
Back to 2V. With the people talking 5.4 + Kenne Bell, since everything is compressed and their exceding the $2500 mark anyway, wouln't the 5.4 factory intake and Kenne Bell 5.4 kit (6 PSI rated) with a pulley change for added boost be safer if only slightly less efficient then a 4.6 manifold with RR adaptor plates? I just see it as one more leak waiting to happen in a forced induction situation, and with air compressed throughout the manifold anyway, you would just want bigger valves and cam grind to let it in the cylinder. For NA, however, I would definately take the plates until the Hardballr comes out.
if all you want is 650hp/650tq...put a kenne bell on your 4v..put a 3" upper pulley/6" lower..the lower pully will generate more TQ...
Sullivan already makes an intake for a 5.4 4V....
#244
05-01-2006, 11:38 AM
Originally Posted by Saleen S330
Yeah i know the stock 2V 5.4 can only take 450 HP to the wheels and anymore, you have to mess with the internals. We'll besides a brake light problem, the car is done. Rob from Pro-dyno, Charlotte NC, came down with a chip and tuned it there in the carport. He messed with several things to get me by till i go there in 2 weeks to get a dyno/tune. And i knew and he knew it has alot more potential but....man...we kept doing second gear runs so he could check things out and all i have to say is....HARD...it's pulls soooo freak'n hard and when the stage 2 heads take over up top, it's then pulls harder. With some cams and that 5.4 intake, it will be awesome. This 5.4 can't touch my 4.6 that i had, not even close.
came down with a chip and tuned it there in the carport. He messed with several things to get me by till i go there in 2 weeks to get a dyno/tune. And i knew and he knew it has alot more potential but....man...we kept doing second gear runs so he could check things out and all i have to say is....HARD...it's pulls soooo freak'n hard and when the stage 2 heads take over up top, it's then pulls harder. With some cams and that 5.4 intake, it will be awesome. This 5.4 can't touch my 4.6 that i had, not even close.we DEMAND vids!!!!!!!!!
#245
05-01-2006, 11:39 AM
Originally Posted by chip6990
if all you want is 650hp/650tq...put a kenne bell on your 4v..put a 3" upper pulley/6" lower..the lower pully will generate more TQ...
Sullivan already makes an intake for a 5.4 4V....
Sullivan already makes an intake for a 5.4 4V....
#249
05-01-2006, 12:09 PM
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Magrathea/California
Posts: 9,865
4v are a lot harder for GT guys to integrate. If you have a 4v already (cobra) then going 4v 5.4 makes more sense. For us a 2V makes more power than we'll really have a daily need for. Add a little nitrous or a blower and we're still crappin in tall cotton.
#251
05-01-2006, 02:16 PM
Originally Posted by 01GTBlown
I just remembered i heard a big thing was the wiring! Does anyone know if you have to rewire a bunch of things or not?
unless you just got $$$ to burn, swapping a 2V to a 4V (5.4 or 4.6) just aint worth it...IMO..
too much wiring problems, swap computers...too much hassle
#252
05-01-2006, 02:48 PM
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Magrathea/California
Posts: 9,865
Originally Posted by 01GTBlown
I just remembered i heard a big thing was the wiring! Does anyone know if you have to rewire a bunch of things or not?
#253
05-02-2006, 10:11 AM
Originally Posted by chip6990
if all you want is 650hp/650tq...put a kenne bell on your 4v..put a 3" upper pulley/6" lower..the lower pully will generate more TQ...
Sullivan already makes an intake for a 5.4 4V....
Sullivan already makes an intake for a 5.4 4V....
. I'd rather have a coupe for weight and rigidity purposes with that much power. A 4.6 2V can make about 650/600 on pump gas, so I was commenting that the same setup just with a 5.4 would just be bonus torque, Yeah!:clap: Again, this is obviously not the $2500 swap most people are contemplating, but I was thinking that might be a better route to go with the cobra instead of supercharging since I don't want to go as crazy with a convertible. It's also harder to get a quality "hidden" roll cage. Again, not that I would ever drive it crazy.
#254
05-02-2006, 10:15 AM
Originally Posted by 97_Cobra_Droptop
yeah, 650hp/650tq, would be a bit much with the top cut off, especially should it roll, not that I ever drive crazy or anything . I'd rather have a coupe for weight and rigidity purposes with that much power. A 4.6 2V can make about 650/600 on pump gas, so I was commenting that the same setup just with a 5.4 would just be bonus torque, Yeah!:clap: Again, this is obviously not the $2500 swap most people are contemplating, but I was thinking that might be a better route to go with the cobra instead of supercharging since I don't want to go as crazy with a convertible. It's also harder to get a quality "hidden" roll cage. Again, not that I would ever drive it crazy.
. I'd rather have a coupe for weight and rigidity purposes with that much power. A 4.6 2V can make about 650/600 on pump gas, so I was commenting that the same setup just with a 5.4 would just be bonus torque, Yeah!:clap: Again, this is obviously not the $2500 swap most people are contemplating, but I was thinking that might be a better route to go with the cobra instead of supercharging since I don't want to go as crazy with a convertible. It's also harder to get a quality "hidden" roll cage. Again, not that I would ever drive it crazy.yea by all means if you done a 5.4 4V swap N/A with good cams, 11:1 comp...that would be killer, plus the comp ratio is still low enough to add a little N2O if you wanted...but not boost friendly
#255
05-02-2006, 10:25 AM
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Magrathea/California
Posts: 9,865
of course you drive crazy... you're probably fairly young and your drive a factory hotrod. Be real... haha
A KB or turbo setup on a 4V 5.4 would be scary fast and have torque enough that special driveline considerations need to be looked at. 9" rear, TKO600 tranny, 4" aluminum DS, driveshaft hoop, scatter shield for the clutch, heavy duty clutch (spec stage 3 ish). Running it in a vert means in-floor subframes area good idea and a full cage, ho hidden stuff.
600 is just unstreetable in most cases. Not always but usually.
A KB or turbo setup on a 4V 5.4 would be scary fast and have torque enough that special driveline considerations need to be looked at. 9" rear, TKO600 tranny, 4" aluminum DS, driveshaft hoop, scatter shield for the clutch, heavy duty clutch (spec stage 3 ish). Running it in a vert means in-floor subframes area good idea and a full cage, ho hidden stuff.
600 is just unstreetable in most cases. Not always but usually.
#256
05-03-2006, 05:40 PM
You caught me. Yeah, I'm 21, but since my 87 Daytona went down, I've been driving it everyday, everywhere, so I do behave myself. For the most part. Good luck trying to convince the cops though. I got on the highway one morning on my way to work and some guy flew up behind me doing 82 in a 60 (cop clocked him). Saw my car in front, and even though I got passed, we were racing and I was going faster. I decided to take defensive driving to keep it off my driving record, but my unit went to the field during my window and the judges gave me zero leniency, said I was given a deadline. Then the other day a SVT lighting tried to mess with me and I blew him off, he slowed down when he almost rearended someone, and the cop passed him and rode my ***. Since I still, hadn't reached the speed limit, there really wasn't much else he could do.
As far as a 5.4 with 11:1 compression, I was thinking more like 8/8.5:1. I would think a 5.4 makes enough torque without nitrous. Especially supercharged. And yeah, a car like that wouldn't see much street time, more so at the strip, so yeah, full roll, racing harness, escape hammer/cutter, 9" locking rear end, 17X10.5 wheels, BF Goodrich TA drag radials, good times.
As far as a 5.4 with 11:1 compression, I was thinking more like 8/8.5:1. I would think a 5.4 makes enough torque without nitrous. Especially supercharged. And yeah, a car like that wouldn't see much street time, more so at the strip, so yeah, full roll, racing harness, escape hammer/cutter, 9" locking rear end, 17X10.5 wheels, BF Goodrich TA drag radials, good times.
#258
05-04-2006, 07:57 PM
Originally Posted by r3dn3ck
of course you drive crazy... you're probably fairly young and your drive a factory hotrod. Be real... haha
A KB or turbo setup on a 4V 5.4 would be scary fast and have torque enough that special driveline considerations need to be looked at. 9" rear, TKO600 tranny, 4" aluminum DS, driveshaft hoop, scatter shield for the clutch, heavy duty clutch (spec stage 3 ish). Running it in a vert means in-floor subframes area good idea and a full cage, ho hidden stuff.
600 is just unstreetable in most cases. Not always but usually.
A KB or turbo setup on a 4V 5.4 would be scary fast and have torque enough that special driveline considerations need to be looked at. 9" rear, TKO600 tranny, 4" aluminum DS, driveshaft hoop, scatter shield for the clutch, heavy duty clutch (spec stage 3 ish). Running it in a vert means in-floor subframes area good idea and a full cage, ho hidden stuff.
600 is just unstreetable in most cases. Not always but usually.
#259
05-05-2006, 11:07 AM
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Magrathea/California
Posts: 9,865
I pop by the Tremec web site every so often to see what offerings they have. I hadn't even known about the 6060 till just now (about to go look it up). So, first thing first, thanks for the info. I like new info, it makes me happy.
My only issue with the T56 is cost over power rating. I know dozens of terminator cobra drivers that are popping 650lbs from their car through the stock t56 wtih no trouble but it's still not rated for it. For myself (anyone can disagree) I don't like using drivetrain components in excess of their design parameters. Sure thousands of people get away with it every day but it only takes one time for me to have to walk home. Also, I've been building my car for competition in the Silver State Classic Challenge where I'll be using most of the available power for in excess of 30 minutes straight. 11 second bursts of abuse are different than half hour to 45 minute beatings on road courses.
I'm on my 4th 3650 and I'm only putting 245/280 down on my 4.6 so I think the 5.4 is going to need a TKO for my application. Guys that don't race much can use a T5/T45/TR3650/etc.. with little risk of walking.
My only issue with the T56 is cost over power rating. I know dozens of terminator cobra drivers that are popping 650lbs from their car through the stock t56 wtih no trouble but it's still not rated for it. For myself (anyone can disagree) I don't like using drivetrain components in excess of their design parameters. Sure thousands of people get away with it every day but it only takes one time for me to have to walk home. Also, I've been building my car for competition in the Silver State Classic Challenge where I'll be using most of the available power for in excess of 30 minutes straight. 11 second bursts of abuse are different than half hour to 45 minute beatings on road courses.
I'm on my 4th 3650 and I'm only putting 245/280 down on my 4.6 so I think the 5.4 is going to need a TKO for my application. Guys that don't race much can use a T5/T45/TR3650/etc.. with little risk of walking.
#262
05-06-2006, 04:09 PM
Ok, as best as I can tel, the TR6060 is new, as in available this summer on the 07 Ford Shelby GT 500, so expect something a little more official from Tremec in the very near future. Since the T56 can come equipped to handle up to 550 LB/ft and the TKO 600, I personally hold hope for 650-700 rating, but I think tremec has a reputation for underating for the sake of reliability, so even a 600 rating should still hold more. If SVT sets this motor up like the cobra, expect a pulley swap, exhaust and tune so push 700/700. Which has me pondering swapping a 5.4L Triton (Fords 3V truck motor) into a new 3V mustang. If the same numbers are possible, that would be outstanding. If these motors all swap so easily and weight difference is almost negligable, I'm surprised this isn't more popular, at least in some older GTs that are paid off and out of warranty.
#263
05-06-2006, 07:34 PM
Originally Posted by 97_Cobra_Droptop
If these motors all swap so easily and weight difference is almost negligable, I'm surprised this isn't more popular, at least in some older GTs that are paid off and out of warranty.
#264
05-06-2006, 09:24 PM
Hey r3dn3ck, I've been reading up on the maximum motorsports panhard bar for the 99-04 GT, and I definately see why you got it, so here's my question to you: Will this fit, either directly or slightly modified, in 96-98 solid axel 8.8, GT or Cobra? Basically: I want!!! To me, this goes beyond improved performance to improved safety, with 2" of lateral movement in the axel? Why wouldn't you want one? I'll try to look around more myself, but you seem to be the man with the connections. Thanx
tonight. The one I want is right there next to it :loser: wow :wallbash:
#266
05-07-2006, 08:10 AM
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Magrathea/California
Posts: 9,865
Jep... I have a 98 Cobra axle on my 03GT. I use the PHB assembly for the 96-98 and a heavy duty Torque arm.
Oh yeah, bolt it in, then have it welded down. You can expect the handling to improve but the way the PHB fixes the natural wiggle is unexpectedly noticable. After I got the PHB welded up I went tooling around and it immediately felt like the whole car was structurally a lot stouter. I know that it was a result of the PHB but still. It made that much difference. I took it onto my favorite one-lane mountain goat-path and it was startlingly stable and a lot more fun. It also loosened up a good bit so I had to slow a little more coming into the corners but I could stomp on it earlier and drift the apex with total control and just point at the exit when it came time.
With a MM coil over kit and tubular arms all around it's an incredible handling machine.
Note: stock 4-link and the PHB is very nice too but I noticed a bit of bind over parking lot entrance grades, railroad tracks and speed bumps. Kind of a pop-bwaaaaang telling me I had it flexed too far for my bushing type. I raised up the rear a 1/2" and that fixed that problem (mostly) but made the rear a lot looser. Point is, one change affects all the others. Now that my car handles light years better than stock, I notice the most minor deficiencies lots easier. So will you.
For those just recently joining us, remember to consider slightly stiffer front springs if you are moving to a 5.4 bottom end. You'll thank me later.
Oh yeah, bolt it in, then have it welded down. You can expect the handling to improve but the way the PHB fixes the natural wiggle is unexpectedly noticable. After I got the PHB welded up I went tooling around and it immediately felt like the whole car was structurally a lot stouter. I know that it was a result of the PHB but still. It made that much difference. I took it onto my favorite one-lane mountain goat-path and it was startlingly stable and a lot more fun. It also loosened up a good bit so I had to slow a little more coming into the corners but I could stomp on it earlier and drift the apex with total control and just point at the exit when it came time.
With a MM coil over kit and tubular arms all around it's an incredible handling machine.
Note: stock 4-link and the PHB is very nice too but I noticed a bit of bind over parking lot entrance grades, railroad tracks and speed bumps. Kind of a pop-bwaaaaang telling me I had it flexed too far for my bushing type. I raised up the rear a 1/2" and that fixed that problem (mostly) but made the rear a lot looser. Point is, one change affects all the others. Now that my car handles light years better than stock, I notice the most minor deficiencies lots easier. So will you.
For those just recently joining us, remember to consider slightly stiffer front springs if you are moving to a 5.4 bottom end. You'll thank me later.
#267
05-07-2006, 12:54 PM
Originally Posted by r3dn3ck
Jep... I have a 98 Cobra axle on my 03GT. I use the PHB assembly for the 96-98 and a heavy duty Torque arm.
Oh yeah, bolt it in, then have it welded down. You can expect the handling to improve but the way the PHB fixes the natural wiggle is unexpectedly noticable. After I got the PHB welded up I went tooling around and it immediately felt like the whole car was structurally a lot stouter. I know that it was a result of the PHB but still. It made that much difference. I took it onto my favorite one-lane mountain goat-path and it was startlingly stable and a lot more fun. It also loosened up a good bit so I had to slow a little more coming into the corners but I could stomp on it earlier and drift the apex with total control and just point at the exit when it came time.
With a Maximum Motorsports coil over kit and tubular arms all around it's an incredible handling machine.
Note: stock 4-link and the PHB is very nice too but I noticed a bit of bind over parking lot entrance grades, railroad tracks and speed bumps. Kind of a pop-bwaaaaang telling me I had it flexed too far for my bushing type. I raised up the rear a 1/2" and that fixed that problem (mostly) but made the rear a lot looser. Point is, one change affects all the others. Now that my car handles light years better than stock, I notice the most minor deficiencies lots easier. So will you.
For those just recently joining us, remember to consider slightly stiffer front springs if you are moving to a 5.4 bottom end. You'll thank me later.
Oh yeah, bolt it in, then have it welded down. You can expect the handling to improve but the way the PHB fixes the natural wiggle is unexpectedly noticable. After I got the PHB welded up I went tooling around and it immediately felt like the whole car was structurally a lot stouter. I know that it was a result of the PHB but still. It made that much difference. I took it onto my favorite one-lane mountain goat-path and it was startlingly stable and a lot more fun. It also loosened up a good bit so I had to slow a little more coming into the corners but I could stomp on it earlier and drift the apex with total control and just point at the exit when it came time.
With a Maximum Motorsports coil over kit and tubular arms all around it's an incredible handling machine.
Note: stock 4-link and the PHB is very nice too but I noticed a bit of bind over parking lot entrance grades, railroad tracks and speed bumps. Kind of a pop-bwaaaaang telling me I had it flexed too far for my bushing type. I raised up the rear a 1/2" and that fixed that problem (mostly) but made the rear a lot looser. Point is, one change affects all the others. Now that my car handles light years better than stock, I notice the most minor deficiencies lots easier. So will you.
For those just recently joining us, remember to consider slightly stiffer front springs if you are moving to a 5.4 bottom end. You'll thank me later.
#269
05-08-2006, 03:56 PM
I will definitley get one going. I just need to find someone to ride with me so it's not to shakey or dangerous
I need the 4 point roll cage for convertibles and a camera mount.
I did go to Darlington dragway on Saturday but ran crappy times. The tires would spin in 1st,second,third and several times in 4th. They just re-paved the track. After somemore cars lay down some rubber, it should be stickier. Several times, i would get off the gas in second and get traction, goose it again and the tires would break loose. My friends V6 beat me at one point cause of the traction. The first time it spun even in 4th gear, i ran a mid 17. Best mid 14 with a little spinning in 3rd. I even grannied it off the line in first but second and 3rd would always break loose. The 295 street tires are no help, i'm getting some drag radials very soon.
I need the 4 point roll cage for convertibles and a camera mount.
I did go to Darlington dragway on Saturday but ran crappy times. The tires would spin in 1st,second,third and several times in 4th. They just re-paved the track. After somemore cars lay down some rubber, it should be stickier. Several times, i would get off the gas in second and get traction, goose it again and the tires would break loose. My friends V6 beat me at one point cause of the traction. The first time it spun even in 4th gear, i ran a mid 17. Best mid 14 with a little spinning in 3rd. I even grannied it off the line in first but second and 3rd would always break loose. The 295 street tires are no help, i'm getting some drag radials very soon.
#270
05-08-2006, 04:09 PM
A pic of us at Darlington letting the cars cool down. The orange 04 V6 is the one that beat me. It does have 3.73 gears, ford posi, X pipe, dual pypes exhaust, mac straight shot, pulleys, lowered. But the second time we raced, i spun then up to 3rd, he was beside me, and when i hooked, i left him in the rearview, and like he said when i did hook "damn that car is fast" sweet!
Other one is a 04 GT-4.10's, auburn posi, 31 spline axles, JLT CAI, Bassani X pipe, flowmasters, C&L plenum, he spun them alot too.
Other one is a 04 GT-4.10's, auburn posi, 31 spline axles, JLT CAI, Bassani X pipe, flowmasters, C&L plenum, he spun them alot too.