So after the heads and intake thing... he gained 60 or so hp and lost 10 ftlb... that don't seem right. I want a lot of torque, so i guess i would start out with the bones stock motor running threw the auto and 3.27s for now. So you think i should show 220/370 with a bigger t/b and u/d's... If so that would be killer to start with... then as bugget alows i would move to the heads and cams. So one question though... say for instance Saleen330 had patriot stage two heads right? well would it not help out more to get the stage 3 heads with the bigger intake valve? these motors need more valve right? Thanks

O and by the way ... i scrapped the dohc swap thing b/c i just had to relize that i don't have that kinda money laying around... right now i have way more important things to worry about. lol , so it will be slow going

 

His tune wasn't 100% with those numbers. There were still fuel curve and timing optimizations that could have bumped both sides a bit. He gained an unknown number. There's no way of knowing if his motor would have made 220 with stock heads. Nonetheless he did see substantial gains from just the porting... probably at minimum 15-20rwhp by my estimation. Stage 3 would be even better... hell a race port wouldn't be too bad considering the starting point. I think a better tune would have made things much more interesting.

The 5.4 brings more tq than you'll know what to do with in almost any configuration. Do as much as you can before you put it in the car. Once it's in there you can't even get the valve covers off without jockeying the motor around a bit.. or even dropping it entirely in some cases.

 

hey shady... would you consider selling me the hardware kit from your plates? I need a second set... mine seem to have grown legs.


btw... I'll let shady slide. He's been coming back for a while now. I don't think he's gotten the answers he was looking for on his 5.4 3v 96-97gt swap or he'd probably spend a lot more time here.

 

Now: Since I've come to find out that we kinda left him hangin: let's see if we can't get the info he needs.

Shady: Please ask specific questions about your 3v swap and I will at least talk to my wrenches and see if I can't provide the info you need. Remember, it's NOT HARD. The whole swap is just a 3v swap. The bottom end and intake issues are going to be custom but I think we can get you in touch with the right people.

 

I'm still here lurking, I check the board daily on weekdays. Just no new updates, still havent been to pick up the shortblock

I have done my share of homework on the 3v and if you are building a BUILT 3v motor vs a BUILT 2v motor - the 3v is a bit cheaper. VCT can be disabled by unplugging the noids and using adjustable cam gears. CMCV valves can be removed with a pair of CMCV plates, although on a 5.4 I would reccomend making a custom set of adapter/CMCV plates to address the additional width of the 5.4 block vs the 4.6 intake.

I don't like the 5.4 3v intake, not one bit.

 

sorry, off topic

but was it in this thread that someone posted a picture of cobra R heads with the navi intake gasket to show the difference between ports on the heads?

i've been looking for that picture for days now.

 

not that I recall.

 

i've been bouncing around forums for so long i really have no idea where i saw it at.

ok, back to the topic.

 

i saw it somewhere too last week. but i don't know where sorry.

 

O i thought that was with the stock heads... just with 75mm t/b and ported plenum with underdrives?

So you can't pull the covers on the 5.4? hmmm that sucks.

 

pull the brake booster and you may be able to get that one off...

the magazine article car made 220 with bone stock motor and bolt-ons. Saleens car was much stronger with just ported heads. The roush around here used a stock bottom end with a pretty radical top side. He could have seen 350rwhp with a better intake design.

 

must have been on sn95F. you are the void over there also right?

 

yea voidfinger

so would you still have to pull the booster if you have a hydrobooster brake setup? One more thing too, some said that if you go with the adapter plates then it will mess up your spray pattern for the injectors ? could you talk about that please?

O and i'm wondering...i've seen a pi swapped 98 make 24x something hp to the wheel with just an off road h and cat back "stock heads, intake, and cam"... so would the 5.4 make less hp? that just don't seem right.

 

so far here is what mine has:
bored .020"( fully forged internals)
pi heads port matched
comp cams 270's
bigger stainless steel valves
adapters matched to intake/head
electric water pump
90mm maf
70mm tb
c&l plenum
cai/K&N
39lbs injectors
kirben fpr
frpp shorty headers
bbk off-road x-pipe
flowmaster(dumped after mufflers)
aluminum flywheel
steeda UDP and timing adjuster
msd coil paks and 8.5mm race wires
egr delete kit

if this doesn't give me some decent numbers, i'm gonna just run myself over....

 

lol i hear ya.

 

so ok i want to do this sawp but idk where to get the plates to make the intake fit as soon as i get that i will buy the motor and get this done

 

you've come to the right place,talk to r3d about a set.

 

Two places I know of offering them.

#1 Reichard Racing
http://www.reichardracing.com

#2 Hi Performance Solutions
http://hiperformancesolutions.com/

Neither one lists the exact part on their sites you just have to call and ask! I would go with the HPS adapter plates as they are an improved design over the RR plates.

 

Red, any comment on this? just wondering thanks

 

I'm not Red but I throw in my .02

If a 4.6 is making 240rwhp and you swap just the short block of a 5.4 you will gain horsepower (with a tune otherwise it will run crazy lean). There is no replacement for displacement, more displacement the more horsepower. Now I could see you maybe gaining only a few horsepower due to the adapter plates maybe, but it should definitely increase. We haven't really seen enough swaps yet to know how the 5.4 will react in all cases.

 

not necessarily the case. While the airflow direction does change, somewhat severely, it is not going to really do much to your injector spray pattern. There will be some slight bit more fallout of fuel but thanks to the much increased vacuum signal, the fuel is going to maintain vaporization better than normal. It's effectively a net zero issue. I chose to (and recommend) porting out Reichard plates at the injector notch to rid them of sharp edges. With the design HPS has it shouldn't be needed but you can still always benefit from checking and making sure everything lines up proper like.

A pi swap raises compression, this creates higher hp and tq numbers without doing anything else. It just doesn't do much. The better flow enables those high compression PI swap motors to put down the same numbers as a well tuned PI motor. With similar cams and bolt-on's the PI and NPI 4.6's are putting out specific output that's about the same. With the 5.4 you WILL have to make airflow improvements to get much in the way of hp gains but you can get 75% of those benefits from just better cams.

This is true so long as you don't restrict the intake tract. Aftermarket parts that are worthless on 4.6's are really useful on 5.4's.

Above all, we all need to keep in mind that if you're swapping in a box stock 5.4, then don't expect the moon in hp... expect the Sun in TORQUE. Expect that everything you do after the swap as far as bolt-on's will be just as worth it.

Once we see what myillwill and I get out of ours we'll know what you can reasonably expect. I think we'll both end up with early to mid 300's for hp and high 300's for tq.

 

cool, can't wait to see

 

Latest porting pics of intake:









All the runner exits have been shaped, major material removal is complete, now it's down to some finish work which I'm tackling daily. I need to complete the job before the install date. I'm hoping for install any week now.

 

well, looks like the dyno might be next weekend if all goes well

 

outstanding.. hey... are you interested in side by side testing my HPS intake on your combo?

If you'll split the shipping with me I'll let you borrow it for your test. If it does good things, I'll port one for you @ no charge (you'll have to buy your own intake... but you're pretty skilled so you could also probably port your own).

 

i'm willing to test yours next to my pi intake/adapters but after i get heron the road i think i'm going for the lightning lower custom intake, i think it would cost less to just spend my time and money on it and leave what i have on it while working on the custom one. i want long tubes and a intake before october...

 

sounds good. Shoot me some shipping details and I'll see how nasty that's likely to get. It's kinda heavy... like 30lbs or so.

 

So that intake you got R3D, doesn't need adapter plates? so that is the one for the 5.4 ?

 

it still needs plates. It's custom ported for 5.4 use but not a specific 5.4 intake. The plates aren't a big detractor with the new design. They'll flow.

BTW... anyone that hasn't yet needs to buy their plates from HPS. If you get them there Bob will work with you on the intake and if you get both from HPS I'll port your plates for 50 bones and your intake for a great price.

 

didn't think the plates needed porting? or is the intake that much more ported ?

So one more question. Say with the stock heads and cams, what would the effective rpm range be? would it do good till 5500? also what about with some vt 2's?