Starting the Buildup of my 4.6 - Mustang Boards

Go Back  Mustang Boards > Mustang Madness > Modular 4.6L Tech
Reload this Page >

Starting the Buildup of my 4.6

Modular 4.6L Tech For all your 1996-2005+ 2V, 3V, and 4V modular motor needs.

Starting the Buildup of my 4.6

Reply

 
 
 
  #1  
Old 08-23-2006, 09:41 PM
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Murfreesboro, TN
Posts: 1,787
Default Starting the Buildup of my 4.6

I came across some extra money for more mods and I wanna start getting into my 4.6 motor. Whats the first thing I should start doing with it? Its still sitting in my shed attatched to the stock K member sitting on the floor. I dont have an engine stand for it yet so that may be something I need to buy. I found out that it will be pretty cheap to have the block honed out and cleaned up. Maybe around $2-300. Theres nothing wrong with the engine, but I wanna make it a beast.

I dont know where to start...I dont know what kind of pistons to buy, or rods, or anything. I know its gonna be bored out .020 over cause I dont wanna try and use the stock size pistons. I am going to put it all together myself. Ill just have the machine work done by a shop. i havent built an engine before, but I have seen others do it, and I have the right resources. I work at a parts store so I can get whatever I need. I know how to use a torque wrench.

im thinking I should start with the bottom end. Is it ok to buy slightly used pistons and rods? I figured why buy new when there just rods right? They really dont wear do they? I might buy a Moroso oil pan from my work for just a couple hundred. I may just throw in a mild cam, some valvesprings, and hand port the heads. Itll be awhile before all of this is done but I cant wait until the motor is in the car!
 
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 08-24-2006, 10:22 AM
r3dn3ck's Avatar
Wowbagger hates me too!
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Magrathea/California
Posts: 9,865
Default

try to take this the right way... put down the crack pipe and step away from the torque wrench.

If you've not done a grip of mod motor builds, have someone else do it. They're finiky and don't like inexperienced hands.

Used pistons and rods are ok sometimes but you never know what you're going to get so you should just pop for new ones. Call my boys at TMD and they'll give you the best price around for a rotating kit. I'd get Probe or Mahle pistons (priceerformance they're great), .020 over is fine but you need to decide what CR you want to run. Flat tops will be like 11:1, 11cc dish will be about stock compression. Rods, use forged 4340 H-beams (TMD has their unbranded Eagles) like Eagle and Probe make. New ARP hardware, new Speed Pro bearings, and have your crank journals polished and measured (before buying bearings). Buying a shortblock is usually cheaper than building it but building it is fun.

I'd burn the 4.6 block and get a 5.4 block... then it'll be a BEAST. Ask saleen s330.
 
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 08-24-2006, 10:27 AM
03gtmustang's Avatar
Super Moderator
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Northern Va
Posts: 3,440
Default

I agree, I wouldnt attemp this yourself. I also think hand porting your heads isnt a good idea.
 
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 08-24-2006, 10:50 AM
r3dn3ck's Avatar
Wowbagger hates me too!
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Magrathea/California
Posts: 9,865
Default

ditto. leave that to someone schooled in the mechanics of fluid dynamics. Air is totally non-intuitive in how it behaves and little things make the big differences. Hand porting without a flow bench to test on is like doing exploratory surgery on your own noggin. Not usually a good idea.

Besides... heads take like 8-15 hours each to get right with a die grinder and a sand roll. That's a lot of time to be spraying yourself with aluminum shavings. My wife almost killed me when she saw all the aluminum powder on the garage floor after I ported a couple plenums and those are maybe 10% of the work a single head is.
 
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 08-24-2006, 12:07 PM
Twin Turbo 330's Avatar
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Aviano, Italy
Posts: 394
Default

I agree with what they have said. I was thinking about doing the same kind of thing. I got a 5.4 motor and i was going to try and port and polish the heads myself then build the bottom end myself. But I've never actually done it before and i want to learn but i don't want to screw it up and have to start over. In a couple of years i plan on going to NTI which is (NASCAR TECHNICAL INSTITUTE) and I'm going to learn how to build engines and p&p heads so i decided to wait until then and know what i'm doing instead of just reading a book and trying to figure it out and hope it works. I would definitely let someone else who has done it before help you build the motor or have them do it. Also i would have someone else p&p your heads. I know it's frustrating to be told this and that you really want to do it but i thought the same thing then came to reality. Anyways good luck man. a

Oh and i'm selling pistons that are good for a 4.6 or 5.4 and rods for a 5.4 if you are interested.
 
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 08-24-2006, 11:13 PM
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Murfreesboro, TN
Posts: 1,787
Default

Originally Posted by Twin Turbo 330
I agree with what they have said. I was thinking about doing the same kind of thing. I got a 5.4 motor and i was going to try and port and polish the heads myself then build the bottom end myself. But I've never actually done it before and i want to learn but i don't want to screw it up and have to start over. In a couple of years i plan on going to NTI which is (NASCAR TECHNICAL INSTITUTE) and I'm going to learn how to build engines and p&p heads so i decided to wait until then and know what i'm doing instead of just reading a book and trying to figure it out and hope it works. I would definitely let someone else who has done it before help you build the motor or have them do it. Also i would have someone else p&p your heads. I know it's frustrating to be told this and that you really want to do it but i thought the same thing then came to reality. Anyways good luck man. a

Oh and i'm selling pistons that are good for a 4.6 or 5.4 and rods for a 5.4 if you are interested.

Man I wanna pull that engine apart so bad. Just pulling it apart would be fun to me. But putting it all back together I dunno. I know a book isnt as good as experience, but whatabout just following the haynes manual and taking my time? I dont wanna pay some guy $2500 for something I could have done myself. Im not going to try and time the motor, I just wanna assemble the bottom end. If theres no way in heck I could do this then I guess paying someone is my only option.....

I get 10% discount on Speed Pro, Comp Cams, and more parts, so thatll make it easier.
 
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 08-24-2006, 11:41 PM
03gtmustang's Avatar
Super Moderator
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Northern Va
Posts: 3,440
Default

If you could assemble the bottom end using a Haynes manual then shops would be going out of business. Theres a reason why it costs a crap load. Let someone else do it.
 
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 08-25-2006, 09:16 AM
r3dn3ck's Avatar
Wowbagger hates me too!
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Magrathea/California
Posts: 9,865
Default

Feel free to yank it apart but keep all the little do-dads well labelled and clean. I've got 3 in the garage I yanked apart to get all the parts I needed for my buildup... it was good experience with how they're put together. Assembly requires as much of a "feel" as it does very special limited use tools, and the basic knowledge of the assembly process. You shouldn't end up paying much more than 500-1K for assembly and you'll know it'll work when you're done.

Trannies are the same way, there are lots of tolerances and things that require tools you wouldn't usually see in the garage of your average dude.

I wanted so bad to assemble my own 5.4 but I'll have an engine builder do it and I'll assist. Hopefully after I've assisted in a dozen or so, I'll be ready to do one by myself. This coming from a guy(me) that does almost all his own work.
 
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 08-25-2006, 04:17 PM
Twin Turbo 330's Avatar
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Aviano, Italy
Posts: 394
Default

It was awesome when i took apart that 5.4 but like i said before find someone who knows what there doing and watch and learn. YOu want to have all of those tolerances perfect and trying to save a little now doing it yourself may end up costing more in the long run.

I sent you a PM back.
 
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 08-25-2006, 04:49 PM
Banned
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 103
Default

3 words- DONT DO IT!!!

Doing an engine yourself with the most basic of knowledge is probably one of the dumbest things ever. Not only will you most likely **** something up on the install, but that one **** up is going to **** up alot of other things and cost you BIG $$$. Pay somebody who does it for a living.
 
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 08-26-2006, 07:57 PM
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Murfreesboro, TN
Posts: 1,787
Default

I am looking at these pistons--->http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Manle...spagenameZWD1V

What kind of power can these handle? Are they good pistons? Is the compression OK for alot of n20? Im not sure if you should go with more compression on a big shot or not. I may put another stage of n20 on it down the road. I may buy these pistons or a 4-channel amp for my car this week.
 
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 08-27-2006, 10:11 AM
r3dn3ck's Avatar
Wowbagger hates me too!
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Magrathea/California
Posts: 9,865
Default

first rule of N2O engines... compression loves nitrous. Hot bracket racer type cars commonly have 13:1-15:1 mechanical compression and use mega doses of giggle gas to great effect. With PI heads those pistons will yeild about 11:1 static compression.

Manley forged pistons can handle whatever you've got a hardon to beat them with. Keep the tune sane and those will provide years of service.
 
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 08-27-2006, 11:24 AM
PureStang's Avatar
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Downingtown/West Chester, PA
Posts: 5,796
Default

Originally Posted by Cobra King
3 words- DONT DO IT!!!

Doing an engine yourself with the most basic of knowledge is probably one of the dumbest things ever. Not only will you most likely **** something up on the install, but that one **** up is going to **** up alot of other things and cost you BIG $$$. Pay somebody who does it for a living.
my friend and i built his engine when it was still in the car...worked fine for us? and that was our first engine build up for the both of us
 
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 08-27-2006, 11:30 AM
Twin Turbo 330's Avatar
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Aviano, Italy
Posts: 394
Default

those are nice pistons but they don't come with the rings and they cost an extra $100 or more for those.
 
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 08-27-2006, 12:57 PM
03gtmustang's Avatar
Super Moderator
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Northern Va
Posts: 3,440
Default

Might want to look into kits from MPH.
 
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 08-28-2006, 12:31 PM
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Murfreesboro, TN
Posts: 1,787
Default

I found a set of 8 Manley Platinum Series Pistons. The guy says they have only been run for 3 dyno pulls. They are 9.0:1 compression, custom bore 3.551"-3.700". The price is $160 shipped. I told him I would take them. I know they arent really the compression I need for n20 but I may throw some boost to it after awhile.

What are the best rings for these pistons? I can get Speed Pro rings pretty cheap.... Now that I have the pistons covered, I need some rods....
 
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 08-28-2006, 12:44 PM
r3dn3ck's Avatar
Wowbagger hates me too!
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Magrathea/California
Posts: 9,865
Default

the custom bore... which is it? they can only be 1 diameter. If they're 3.7" then you're in for a lot of fun. Any compression is good for nitrous, just more compression is easier with nitrous cuz it cools down the charge and helps keep detonation at bay.

For rods, check out TMD offerings on ebay. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/FORD-...spagenameZWD1V

Good inexpensive kick-azz rods. Comparable to probe, eagle, manley.
 
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 08-28-2006, 01:55 PM
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Murfreesboro, TN
Posts: 1,787
Default

Originally Posted by r3dn3ck
the custom bore... which is it? they can only be 1 diameter. If they're 3.7" then you're in for a lot of fun. Any compression is good for nitrous, just more compression is easier with nitrous cuz it cools down the charge and helps keep detonation at bay.

For rods, check out TMD offerings on ebay. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/FORD-...spagenameZWD1V

Good inexpensive kick-azz rods. Comparable to probe, eagle, manley.
What do you mean? Is 3.7" a better choice?
 
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 08-28-2006, 02:10 PM
r3dn3ck's Avatar
Wowbagger hates me too!
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Magrathea/California
Posts: 9,865
Default

no... much worse. 3.7 is about a quarter inch too big and would normally require sleeving of the cylinders and all kinds of nonsense to get them to work. It'd cost at least a grand or better and there's no HG to match that I've ever seen.

3.551 is stock, .020 over (3.57x) is as far as you want to bore a stock ford block out before you start having all kinds of heat issues. 3.58x is right on the edge (.030 over) and is where I start getting reports of hot-spotting in the block.

My question was that you have 3.551-3.7 in your description and I can't tell if that's supposed to be the bore and target stroke or the bore at stock and bore of the pistons you bought.
 
Reply With Quote
 
 
 
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
CCM
Show, Shine, and Tunes!
2
12-07-2005 09:57 AM
Badfish
General Tech Forum
10
06-02-2005 04:26 PM
Stevoneo
General Tech Forum
0
02-16-2005 08:20 PM
MustangMike20
5.0L Tech
1
01-20-2005 08:19 AM
87_5.0
5.0L Tech
4
12-19-2004 07:54 PM


Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Quick Reply: Starting the Buildup of my 4.6


Advertising
Featured Sponsors
Vendor Directory

Contact Us Archive Advertising Cookie Policy Privacy Statement Terms of Service

We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.