Geeze, just STOP already.... We've heard every angle, every opinion and the debate will never end. Someone just close the thread... :argue:

Don't read the thread :poke: :rolleyes:

yeah dude, seriously, if you dont want to read it, dont read it. Just cause YOU are done they need to close it?

Quit being such a...
http://www.drunkdwarves.com/images/ddmail/crybaby.jpg
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
:breakdancesmilie:

then they shouldnt have had sex!!!

Ummmmm, that is the lamest excuse I have ever heard? What do you consider normal? go back to my post a couple pages back. I was making $8 an hour and had to live with my dad. Maybe that wasn't normal, but I did what I had to do to take responsibility for my actions. Yeah it was hard as hell, and yeah I worked 2 jobs at times, and went to night school. But all in all I am a better man for it, and it made me appreciate things more.

It don't matter if you won the lottery the day you found out you were going to be a dad, having a baby there is nothing that will ever be a "normal" life, anyone with kids will tell you that!

Oh for christs sake let this thread die already.

I dont agree with you, i think your viewpoint is clouded by emotion rather than reason, and im glad you are not in charge, i think your expectations are completly unreasonable and unrealistic in the real world.

reread my old posts in this thread to catch up.

:argue: :argue: :argue: What is unreasonable about taking responsibility for your actions. It is not unrealistic to leave a child with someone who just might give a damn unlike yourself. And yes part of my views are clouded by emotions. After losing a child to SIDS. I believe that anything can be done to improve things if enough people start to give a damn. Maybe it is a good ideal that I'm not in charge. All though that also goes for you too.

It never ceases to amaze me how people simply want to lump everything into a black and white category and want to tell everybody else how to run thier lives. It is the sole responsibility of the couple to make that determination, not yours, not the states, not the federal government, and the governemnt agrees, so maybe there ARE people in charge who are like me and actually believe that it is not anybodys business but the pregnant couple.

this has been voted on time and time again, and america has spoken.

As far as me not giving a damn, i have a kid on the way, we still have plenty of time to terminate the pregnancy and that was a consideration as it was unplanned, but in the end we felt like we should have the child and are both looking forward to it. Regardless Im glad i live in a country were i have the right to make my own decisions.

Let people make thier own decisions.


That aside.....

Sorry to hear about your child. That truly is tragic and you have my deepest sympathys.

I appreciate your sympathy. And congratulations on your upcoming child. Now with that being said. You say that it should be up to the couple, but who speaks for the unborn child? Is it your right to decide that just because you don't want someone that you can kill it. I agree that we live in a country that gives us the right to make our own decisions. And that is a great thing I served my country to help keep that right alive. It will always return to the fact that someone has to be able to speak for the unborn child. The people in charge don't really care it's the lobbyist that ultimately decide for the politician. The laws all are made up by polls more than morale judgement. You also said that this thread should end well it won't end as long as you and I keep writing post. After your child is born think about how you would of felt if you had killed it. I wish you all the luck in the world with your soon to be new born
I never believed in abortion before my child die. And yes I am even more against now. You might even change your mind after your baby is born.:t:

Welp, as my old man said time and time again... "I brought you into this world, i can take you out of it"


lol

I tell my kids that all the time and they are all full grown. Notice I didn't say grown up. LOL

The issue of abortion comes down to one point:

Either you think it is murder, or you don't. if you think it is murder, then the issue is black and white for the most part. If you think abortion is healthcare, then there will always be gray areas.

To me it will always be murder. They call themselves "pro choice" does that mean you get to chose whatever you want to do?

Iv'e said this before....I think even on this thread, but being pro-choice for me doesn't mean I'm for abortion.....abortion is a horrible thing, but with that said, the Government shouldn't be able to tell you that you can or can't have an abortion. It's really a personal choice that whatever the person decides better be able to live with it. Why is having that choice so bad?

This issue is not even close to being a black or white issue, there are WAY too many gray areas on this issue and Government should stay out of this one. Oh, and I don't think we have to worry about that since the Democrats took over the House.....Mr. Bush's bible thumpers won't be ruling the country any more....thankfully!

I agree that the Gov. shouldn't dictate the way we live. My only problem with abortion is the same thing thousands of people ask. Who is going to speak for the unborn child. If they play let them pay me and my wife did. I was station in Ca. when she got pregnant. She raised him by herself for 3 months until I got out. Then we lived with my parents for awhile. The subject of abortion never came up. We knew that we had to take responsibility for our actions. We did and 30 years later couldn't be happier.

Imo Abortion should be only legal in the instance of rape, incest, health of mother at risk, or in oddball cases such as if two mentally challenged people do it and she gets knocked up.

Other than that if two normal people **** and get knocked up, tough shit. You should have to man up and take care of your responsibility. There are things called condoms, birth control, or abstinance (which I dont recommend :) )

If need be get her on the pill and use a condom if you really want to be safe.

I totally agree with you. Especially on the abstinence.

you guys are still discussing this...

I agree that abortion should not be used as "birth control". Meaning that people shouldn't just have sex without out using some sort of birth control and then go "oh well, we'll just get an abortion". That is totally not right. I also agree that people should take responsibility for their actions in EVERY aspect of their life.

With that said, lets face it, kids are WAY more advanced and are starting to do everything a little bit earlier.....now what do you guys think should happen if a 15 year old guy knocks up a 13 year old girl? I'm not saying abortion is the way out, but I'm just curious of how you feel about a situation like that.

That's when the kids take the baby to their parents first. If they don't want to help then they go to the hospital, police or church. Or if they are lucky enough maybe they could give the baby to a couple who can't have one but really want one. Most of the time they even pay all the expenses and maybe a little extra. You would want someone who could pay for it all. It doesn't mean the kid will have a great life he or she would probably just not want for very much.

You are missing the point. Government does make laws....you can't speed, you can't kill, etc... and we punnish people for doing these things. If you think abortion is murder, then it is black and white (for the most part - lol).

As far as the elections are concerned, the Conservative movement will never end abortion, because people that kills babies vote. And in a representative majority, the voters rules. This does not make it right, it just makes it legal.

If my kids would have it their way, they would be able to eat whatever they want. If they could vote, I would loose. But, I am the master of my house, so I win....regardless of votes. Majority Rule does not always equal the best thing.

If thats the case the parents need to be shot because they obviously arent that great of parents if their 13 year old is getting ****ed.

Do you have any kids? My parents did a great job of raising the 4 of us. And I still got laid at 13. I thought I was going to be a parent then. We even then never considered abortion. Although it was a long time ago. You do have to keep a better eye on your kids now.

No I dont have kids. I didnt mean to offend you but seriously I stick with my statement before. From what I have seen with the kids that I grew up with. The ones that where knocked up in high school where generally not kids from stable homes. Of course there are always exceptions.

No you didn't offend me. I was just making a statement. Although like I said things are a lot different now then 35 years ago. Yes I am an old man LOL. Some of the kids I know that got pregnant in high school that where in school with my kids did in fact come from an unstable home life. Some not to many came from a good home. You know I'm sure sometimes shit happens.

What T.V. show didn't you grow up on.I don't care if it offends you or not. Thats just a screwed up statement.

Oh,and just so you don't have to look,I'm pro life.

Well I know I'm real glad to hear that. The more pro lifers there are maybe we can get abortion banned again. Except in cases of rape or incest (YUK).

I take no offence because it was a true statement. It may be screwed up and certainly does not mean everywhere is that way. But the high school I went to its true. Im not that old either, 26.