Cam questions
#2
03-10-2006 | 03:38 PM
Traitor...lol
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 7,939
From: Lexington, SC
Ok, here goes real quick like.
Vt cams: Stage one or two.
Stage one : Advantage of GREAT lope, about 20 rwhp gains, and best of all, not having to change the valve springs. Disadvantage is that EVERY cam swap Ive seen loses low end torque, which is what I love the most, so thats out for me.
Stage two: NASTY lope, its AWESOME, BUT you HAVE to get a custom tune to compensate, and need to change the valve springs, which is a PITA and a half. Gains of about 25 rwhp at the peak, but a LONG time ago, VT showed a gain of 50 rwhp on a stock GT in the midrange. Great cams
Comp Cams: Dont know much about the cams other than the fact that TONS of people had PTV(piston to valve) issues with the 270s on their cars. Now, these people typically didnt degree their cams, so maybe that was the problem. Who knows, but IMO, I wouldnt get a comp 270 near my car. The 262's, which I know some members here have, have shown similar results to the VT stage 1's. Also, another advantage for comp, is that you can ACTUALLY GET THEM. Vt has been outta cams for SOME time now, and IMO, is burning TONS of money. If I knew people wanted the cams that damn bad, Id do whatever it took to get em, but thats neither here nor there, because, were I to get cams, Id go nowhere but VT or Tims custom cams from Modular Powerhouse, but we all know im a MPH *****. Hope this helps, IMO, Id get a blower or spray before cams, but its all in what you want, and what you are looking for.
Cam swap is pretty long and complicating. Obviously a LOT harder if you go with a cam that needs new valve springs, which BTW, you should get from Comp Cams, as their beehive springs are perfect for the VT's and the comps. Cost? Well, VT's cams are like 599, I think the comps are close. Springs are about 180-200 if you need them, and since you have the 2001+ car, you wont have to mess with the cam gears, as they are bolted on. Now, for 99 and 00 cars, we have pressed on cam gears, so you have to buy a set of cam gears, or VT sells a nifty kit to swap the gears. Damn, this has turned into an all out tech thread, sticky anyone
Id say total cost at about 6-700 bucks, IF you install them. Also, Id still get a custom dyno tune if I got stage ones, so if you wanna figure this in, figure about 4-500 more for that, and manditory if you go stage twos. So all in all, Id say anywhere from 600 at the cheapest, to over 1k. Another thing, cams are what I consider, a "building block" mod for our cars. They benefit from other stuff, such as LONGTUBES. I put this in bold because cam cars LOVE TO BREATH. Also, they love new intake manifolds, be it a full intake such as a P51, RR, or Bullitt, or just a tb/plenum setup. Just some stuff to consider.
Vt cams: Stage one or two.
Stage one : Advantage of GREAT lope, about 20 rwhp gains, and best of all, not having to change the valve springs. Disadvantage is that EVERY cam swap Ive seen loses low end torque, which is what I love the most, so thats out for me.
Stage two: NASTY lope, its AWESOME, BUT you HAVE to get a custom tune to compensate, and need to change the valve springs, which is a PITA and a half. Gains of about 25 rwhp at the peak, but a LONG time ago, VT showed a gain of 50 rwhp on a stock GT in the midrange. Great cams
Comp Cams: Dont know much about the cams other than the fact that TONS of people had PTV(piston to valve) issues with the 270s on their cars. Now, these people typically didnt degree their cams, so maybe that was the problem. Who knows, but IMO, I wouldnt get a comp 270 near my car. The 262's, which I know some members here have, have shown similar results to the VT stage 1's. Also, another advantage for comp, is that you can ACTUALLY GET THEM. Vt has been outta cams for SOME time now, and IMO, is burning TONS of money. If I knew people wanted the cams that damn bad, Id do whatever it took to get em, but thats neither here nor there, because, were I to get cams, Id go nowhere but VT or Tims custom cams from Modular Powerhouse, but we all know im a MPH *****. Hope this helps, IMO, Id get a blower or spray before cams, but its all in what you want, and what you are looking for.
Cam swap is pretty long and complicating. Obviously a LOT harder if you go with a cam that needs new valve springs, which BTW, you should get from Comp Cams, as their beehive springs are perfect for the VT's and the comps. Cost? Well, VT's cams are like 599, I think the comps are close. Springs are about 180-200 if you need them, and since you have the 2001+ car, you wont have to mess with the cam gears, as they are bolted on. Now, for 99 and 00 cars, we have pressed on cam gears, so you have to buy a set of cam gears, or VT sells a nifty kit to swap the gears. Damn, this has turned into an all out tech thread, sticky anyone
Id say total cost at about 6-700 bucks, IF you install them. Also, Id still get a custom dyno tune if I got stage ones, so if you wanna figure this in, figure about 4-500 more for that, and manditory if you go stage twos. So all in all, Id say anywhere from 600 at the cheapest, to over 1k. Another thing, cams are what I consider, a "building block" mod for our cars. They benefit from other stuff, such as LONGTUBES. I put this in bold because cam cars LOVE TO BREATH. Also, they love new intake manifolds, be it a full intake such as a P51, RR, or Bullitt, or just a tb/plenum setup. Just some stuff to consider.
#3
03-10-2006 | 03:48 PM
DSG!!!
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 3,159
From: Paducah, KY
Not only how much power should you gain but driveability after the swap will change. Plus bigger cams need more upgrades such as intake, exhaust, gears, stall if it's an auto along with changing your stock valve springs, retainers, valves, etc.
The only brand I can really tell you about is VT, because I haven't done a lot of research about Comp cams or Crower. As far as VT goes the Stage 1 is a direct swap, you don't have to change the valvesprings or anything else, it is recommended you have rear end gears.. like 3.55 for example. The powerband for Stage 1 is between 2500-6000, it doesn't really sacrafice a lot of your down low power like some of the bigger cams do. Installing these is suppose to be less work than installing Long Tube Headers and really the only things you would need would be some new gaskets and you might have to buy cam gears depending on the year of your mustang. These are usually good for about 20-25 rwhp. Price for cams is $595.00, gaskets might run you around $50.. some shops charge ~$300-500 for install, depends on if they pull the heads or not. These cams are sorta noticeable at idle, a guy I know that has them says it's not very noticeable to him or some other people, but you can tell a bit of difference in the sound.
VT Stage 2 cams need the valve springs upgrade, but nothing else. You would also want the car to have intake, exhaust, gears, stall if it's an auto and you would definately want to tune your car, lots of people couldn't get it to idle right until they got a tune. The RPM range for these are 3000-6500+ and usually you will see a loss of down low power but you will gain more up high.. usually around 30-35rwhp plus you can shift even further. I think the hardest part of installing cams will be adjusting the timing correctly. Price for cams are $595.00, valvesprings ~$189.00-$239.00 depending on brand, Ford OEM Spring Compressor tool if installing yourself ~$84.00, Gaskets ~$50, paying someone to install would probably be around ~$500. These cams are pretty noticeable at idle.. one of my fav videos of them is from a guy on these forums.. he's got some vids up of his car with them idling on his website http://www.dndgarage.net/picturesvids.htm
The only brand I can really tell you about is VT, because I haven't done a lot of research about Comp cams or Crower. As far as VT goes the Stage 1 is a direct swap, you don't have to change the valvesprings or anything else, it is recommended you have rear end gears.. like 3.55 for example. The powerband for Stage 1 is between 2500-6000, it doesn't really sacrafice a lot of your down low power like some of the bigger cams do. Installing these is suppose to be less work than installing Long Tube Headers and really the only things you would need would be some new gaskets and you might have to buy cam gears depending on the year of your mustang. These are usually good for about 20-25 rwhp. Price for cams is $595.00, gaskets might run you around $50.. some shops charge ~$300-500 for install, depends on if they pull the heads or not. These cams are sorta noticeable at idle, a guy I know that has them says it's not very noticeable to him or some other people, but you can tell a bit of difference in the sound.
VT Stage 2 cams need the valve springs upgrade, but nothing else. You would also want the car to have intake, exhaust, gears, stall if it's an auto and you would definately want to tune your car, lots of people couldn't get it to idle right until they got a tune. The RPM range for these are 3000-6500+ and usually you will see a loss of down low power but you will gain more up high.. usually around 30-35rwhp plus you can shift even further. I think the hardest part of installing cams will be adjusting the timing correctly. Price for cams are $595.00, valvesprings ~$189.00-$239.00 depending on brand, Ford OEM Spring Compressor tool if installing yourself ~$84.00, Gaskets ~$50, paying someone to install would probably be around ~$500. These cams are pretty noticeable at idle.. one of my fav videos of them is from a guy on these forums.. he's got some vids up of his car with them idling on his website http://www.dndgarage.net/picturesvids.htm
#4
03-10-2006 | 03:50 PM
DSG!!!
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 3,159
From: Paducah, KY
and by the way.. if you're going to get a supercharger in the future.. DO NOT use VT N/A cams.. they pull tons of boost right through the exhaust and never get used. But they are great if you're staying N/A lol.
And I'm installing my Stage 2's myself and estimating about ~$1200 for the cams, valvesprings (I'm switching to Manley Nextek springs), dyno tune, spring compressor tool, gaskets.
And I'm installing my Stage 2's myself and estimating about ~$1200 for the cams, valvesprings (I'm switching to Manley Nextek springs), dyno tune, spring compressor tool, gaskets.
#7
03-10-2006 | 04:36 PM
Super Moderator
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 6,312
From: Mexico
Originally Posted by csledd
just as much or more? I'm only spending $1200 instead of $3700 
Granted there's more power in S/C but I could never save that much all at once lol
Granted there's more power in S/C but I could never save that much all at once lolYeah, i meant after heads/cams. If you wanna break outta the 300's you will need p&p heads.
..maybe a bullit intake or a p-51 for kicks....2v's don't make any power n/a at all...
#8
03-10-2006 | 05:41 PM
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,395
From: Northern Virginia
Yeah slappy man, stop spending money on mods like gears and rims and cams, just get a SC. A lot of people go spending money on tons of bolt ons and before they know it they've passed the price of a supercharger. So quit while you're still ahead!
#11
03-11-2006 | 06:29 AM
Traitor...lol
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 7,939
From: Lexington, SC
Hey christie, start a high interest savings account to put your money into, that way, you are saving for the blower, but at the same time, making an assload of interest for doing NOTHING. Just hold out. 1200 bucks at 4 percent interest makes a somewhat decent amount of money over the course of a year, well, its like, free money. AND youd be contributing to it. DO IT DO IT DO IT. Ill even help ya start it if you need. Oh yea, the interest rate just went up to 4.25 btw...
#17
03-11-2006 | 11:45 AM
Traitor...lol
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 7,939
From: Lexington, SC
Originally Posted by 01cobra
a dad *** n/a car is lot more impresive that a car that is blown. i am building a n/a car for that reason. plus cams make a car sound alot better.
#19
03-11-2006 | 12:24 PM
DSG!!!
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 3,159
From: Paducah, KY
Originally Posted by madmatt
LOL and you want CAMS!?!?! Cut the damn thing up, dont go into debt over a damn car. Geez, im starting to sound like you parents...sorry. LOL
Most of the money from the cams is some cash my parents owed me
So it doesn't hurt too bad at all
#20
03-11-2006 | 12:31 PM
Traitor...lol
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 7,939
From: Lexington, SC
Originally Posted by MattJ
1200 x .0425 = 51 free dollars!!!
Im all about some free money.
Im all about some free money.
Me too. www.capitalone.comLOL Christie, lol dont you love it how in todays society we'd rather build credit than wealth...lol jk
#24
03-13-2006 | 06:23 PM
Guest
Posts: n/a
Originally Posted by Mug11
check my sig about how much power you'll make. and i'm goin through an automatic...
my $.02
my $.02
Yah, honestly, my entire goal with a mustang is not to have the fastest car out there. if i wanted a real fast car i woulda bought an evo.
I wanted a muscle car, and dammit, i would like it to sound like a mucle car too. <grin>
Cams sound like what im looking for. I love the sound. Besides, i hardly ever street race, and really dont care if im the fastest or not.
#25
03-13-2006 | 06:39 PM
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 540
From: Rochester NY
Originally Posted by Jack The Ripper
Not bad...
Yah, honestly, my entire goal with a mustang is not to have the fastest car out there. if i wanted a real fast car i woulda bought an evo.
I wanted a muscle car, and dammit, i would like it to sound like a mucle car too. <grin>
Cams sound like what im looking for. I love the sound. Besides, i hardly ever street race, and really dont care if im the fastest or not.
Yah, honestly, my entire goal with a mustang is not to have the fastest car out there. if i wanted a real fast car i woulda bought an evo.
I wanted a muscle car, and dammit, i would like it to sound like a mucle car too. <grin>
Cams sound like what im looking for. I love the sound. Besides, i hardly ever street race, and really dont care if im the fastest or not.
Same hear I would rather have the loudest mustang than the fastest mustang.
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