Gun collecters in here need some help
 

I know a lot of the people on this board collect guns, and i have a question for you. What is the best way to go about buying a quality used handgun? I don't wanna buy an expensive brand new one, but still want something of decent quality. Any suggestions? Also I'm not sure exactly what caliber i want either. I mostly just want something for some range plinking and just to have in my house in case someone tries to robs us. And I'm 21 with no record so I can legally own a handgun no problem.

for just around the house and occasional target shooting...

well I personally like the .38 Smith & Wesson Special...

they are great quality guns... not too extreme like a .44, but not real wimpy like a glock...

When it comes to firearms, you get what you pay for in quality. If you are not experienced with handguns then a revolver is the way to go. Get a .357 magnum and you can use .38 special ammo at the range to have a little "cheap" fun and when you get home you can throw in some .357's to stop any unwanted intruders. As far as a glock being whimpy, I'm not sure what you mean since they are top quality auto's. I only own 3 of them but I like them all as well as my H&K and sigs.
Go for a used smith & wesson or colt if you can find one, or if $ is an issue a ruger or a taurus will do you just fine.:comeandgetsome:

eh... i was just saying that the .38 has a little more balls...

and on another note... .357s are some of the most powerful handguns made...

.357 is just a .38 with a longer case and a larger powder charge, and in it's day it was at the top of the power chart. But today it is a middle of the road cartridge in terms of recoil and knock down power. My wife is 4'11" and 107lbs and shoots my Colt Python .357 with no problem, but she does not want any part of my 10mm or my .44 and .500 magnums. I don't like my .500 S&W magnum either though. But it looks cool in the safe.

How do you guys feel about the Springfield XD?

I have not personally fired one, but I always pick them up and handle them at the shows and it feels great. Springfield makes top quality products so I am sure it a fine piece. I haven't picked one up yet because all my extra $$$ has been going in my pony lately.

First, you may want to stear clear of guns you have never heard of before if you aren't experienced with guns. I'm not saying the only good guns are S&W and Remington, but if you don't know much about guns then you would want to stick with picking one made by a major gun producer such as those two.

Second, if you are buying it at a store and not online, ask to see it and if it's a slide pistol then cock the slide back and look around in the reciever, make sure everything seems to be pretty clean and nothing is bent or dicked up. Any good gun seller will throughly clean each gun before putting it up for sale so if the gun is pretty dirty inside then you may want to stear clear because it may not be in very good working condition.

If I were you I'd get a .45. Remington makes a good ACP, so go with a .40 or .45. It'll stop anyone trying to intrude into your house and they're a hell of a lot of fun to shoot. It's not so powerful that your tired of shooting after 15 min so I'd say it's one of your best choices.

Eh.. i wouldn't go any higher than 9MM if you're just going to buy it to have some occasional fun, .45 and .45ACP and .357 and .40 etc is too expensive if you want to go to the range every month and fire off 500 rounds, and I'd get 9mm especially if you haven't previously owned any other handguns, I'd get the feel for less overkill round before going to a larger caliber.. kind of like starting on a .22 for rifles, instead of going straight to a 7.62 AK47, lol.
Besides, 9mm ammo is dirt cheap compared to that stuff. For a plinker you really can't go wrong with a glock or M92, if you have any quarterly/montly gunshows over there I'd go check those out and see if they have some you can handle. The ones over here do not let us fire the weapons but we can pick them up and get a feel for them...I wouldn't spend anymore than 600$, though..gunshow prices can be reasonable sometimes but you might have to bargain with em to get a good deal.

And for people that say a 9mm round is a pussy round and has terrible stopping power - LOL. Yeah, maybe if the guy you're shooting at has level III body armor..

.38 special has the least muzzle energy and velocity of all the cartridges mentioned, except for the .22. it's been around for almost 100 years, so it's just a little obsolete. 9mm is a little bit light for personal defense, but is about the cheapest centerfire handgun round you can buy (100 rds. for $12 @ wal-mart, winchester made) Remington does not make handguns. Personally, i believe the most balanced round is .40 s&w. it's got more energy than most .45 acp rounds, w/ the exception of +P. plus, it's only a little more expensive than the 9mm. i would also recommend the .357 mag. it's not really that powerful of a round, but plenty of knockdown power for intruders. like someone already said above, you can shoot .38 special through it for cheap. honestly, though, if you're looking for a somewhat responsible home defense weapon, i'd get a shotgun. mid-to-high powered handguns have a way of shooting through walls and possibly injuring people. shotgun pellets lose enery much quicker, and that way you don't kill the guy next door to you.

I beg to differ...

My father took a deer down (8 pointer, big) with his S&W .38 special from 15-20 yards... so its pretty potent...

Its also one of the most perferred guns by law enforcment and many detectives...

Its not a handcannon, but its not a watergun...

And the cartidges hold more powder then a 9mm...

Its also very easy to conceal if you get one with a shorter barrell... and the smaller size also makes it more ideal for home defense/ indoor/ close range shooting... It would easily knock a man off his feet and keep him down

you can disagree all you want, but you should probably check out a ballistics chart before you do. it WAS one of the most preferred guns by law enforcement and detectives... forty years ago.

http://world.guns.ru/ammo/am02-e.htm

If it will will take a deer down @ 15 yards...

It sure as hell will take down a man in your living room...

And as far as that chart goes... different ammunition companies bullets differ from each other... so just cause some kind or other was measured at that... doesn't mean the rest are too...

I'm rather surprised at the chart too... I assume you've seen the difference in size between the .38 special and 9mm bullets...

Alright..when buying a used gun, since you don't know much.. DO NOT buy a semi auto. There are too many mechanical parts in there, and if you don't know how to take it apart and put it back together, you're in deep shit. Not to mention, it could be damaged.

Like Greg and a few others said.. .38s are great. A .357 mag is nothing but a high powered .38 and you can fire .357s and .38 specials through it...

The first handgun I ever fired was a Ruger Blackhawk, .357 3 5/8 barrel. I was 9 firing a hot load through it.

As for power, well, it'll peirce a v8, and with the right grain, it'll go straight through. Its got a high velocity. Now, here is something else to note, the longer the barrel, the less recoil. I personally don't like longer barrels, but to each his own.

There are higher calibers, with more stopping force (meaning better human-knock-down power) such as a .40 caliber, or a .45 ...

Honestly though, a .357 would be great for your first handgun, then maybe go out and buy yourself a semi auto .45 or .40 and learn about them..

+1 and somewhere around a 4" barrell will give you a small enough package and still give you the accuracy when you go to the range to plink.

okay so i am going to a few different places this weekend to look at revolvers. i think i have decided to go with a .357. Any other suggestions?

I think the one thing everyone has missed in every post is that you should go to a gun safety class first, period. If you dont have very much experience like you said, than you didn't have an adult show you whats really going on with gun ownership. no offence, but you have to respect and understand the very item you want to buy. also, consider what you really what the gun for, more target and less defense or the other way around. personally, i'd go with a shotgun, a remington 870 express 3" mag with a 26" barrel, .665 full choke and #5 XX turkey loads is going to make someone have a very bad day. you can get all that for under $300 new, plus you have a gun for skeet shooting (which is fun as hell) and a cannon to rip someone apart if need be. you may very well want a handgun, and thats ok just do your homework and find someone who shoots regularly and ask them to take you to the range to shoot some different guns they may have. nothing worse than buying a gun and then finding out you can't stand it, because there is no return policy on that kind of stuff....all firearm sales are final.

A revolver is much better for home defense then a shotgun... smaller is better for close corridor shooting...

A shotgun from 10 feet would obliterate a body... talk about a mess... unless you are using bird shot. If I needed to defend myself or family, I would not be using bird shot...

+shotguns shoot alot different then handguns

in fact... police officers (in general) are bad shots with a handgun... but they are by far worse shots with a shotgun... (my pops is a retired trooper, so i assume thats true)

.357 will take out a horse...

I would try going to a range and test shooting a few guns before you go with a .357

oh and heres a gun safety lesson

1. always assume a gun is loaded
2. never rely on a safety THEY DO FAIL
3. never point a gun at anyone, even if it is unloaded (unless you intend on shooting)
4. Know your target AND BEYOND...
5. always keep amo away from the gun, and keep both LOCKED
6. after shooting gun, be sure to clean it well.

i guess im just partial to my 870, i keep my turkey choke in it all the time with three shells very close by. and i know what ever is on the recieving end is going down....hard n fast. and as far as range goes i put out 45 yard patterns with 35+ shots in the kill zone a on turkey, and thats not counting the ones not touching the head or neck. messy, maybe...but its also very intimidating.

I owuld not want to have to clean up after shooting someone indoors w/ a 12g

uhhhhhh, thanks Dad. J/K I'm well aware of gun safety and have shot them many times, (even had the merit badge in boy scouts) just never owned my own. But I know you were just trying to keep me from accidentally killing myself or someone else so I do appreciate it. Oddly enough, I've fired many rifles and handguns, but don't have alot of experience with shotguns. Which i am now leaning towards, since they are less expensive and have less chance of going through the wall and hurting someone on the other side. I looked at a nice Remington 870 express today: 12 gauge, short barrel, no choke. Thinking about getting that instead (pretty sure unless someone comes up with a REALLY GOOD reason i should still buy a handgun). it's only $370 and the .357 i was looking at was $550. And I've been told that if I use real small birdshot at the range, the recoil won't be so bad that i can't fire off a hundred or so shells, and then save the double aught for home. Also i want a Remington because thats what the military uses to guard embassies and they come highly recommended by my marine friends. And don't say to get a 20 gauge because I'm not a pussy and can deal with the recoil of a 12.


And greg if someone tries to rob me, i will let the cops clean it up.

Idk, in the state of california before you can own a gun you have to...

1. Pass the safety test and have the cert
2. A handgun requires a handgun cert
3. Have a clean record

So basically, it wasn't OVERLOOKING a thing, it was the assumption that other states had some sort of mandatory thing before they could go out and buy a gun.

As far as home defence goes.. a shotgun is bad because of one thing...having to weild it around ... with a handgun you can easily move around and not smack your barrel into a wall...

As far as safeties go..on a revolver, there normally isn't one.. because the only way for it to fire is that hammer has to be pulled back and locked, unless its a double action...

But yes, the basic safety rules are Always point the gun in a safe direction, never point the gun at someone, always assume the gun is loaded, everytime you handle a weapon, check to see if its loaded regardless on whether you know it is or not, know whats beyond your target, ect...

As far as brands for a .357

A pretty, reliable, and well established company is Ruger..and its relatively inexpensive compared to S&W, Springfield, and Kimber... its up to you though.

uh... recoil on a 12g?

lol...

My pops has alot of guns... Now we've got a bunch of shotguns...

Ithica 12g pump
S&W 12g pump (old)
remington autoloader

they all shoot best with different shot...

So if you go with a shotgun... ya'll want to buy several kinds of amo to test with...

Now the S&W has the biggest kick of them all... with magnum high brass triple O buckshot... I can shoot a good 100 rounds before my shoulder begins to get sore...

Also... idk how hunting is out there in the hippy state... but shotguns can take out a deer from 30yards easy... so it sure will go through a wall... lol

Don't worry about the kick... you should be able to handle it...

i agree w/ the shotgun thing, however, i wouldn't pay $370 for an 870. you can find one for less than 300 brand new. 870s are nice, though. most popular shotgun in the world for a reason.

might be 300 in idaho..but in cali they are closer to 400 =x

If you're getting a shotgun to do trap and skeet and just shoot for fun, go with a 20. They're a lot more fun to shoot if you're out all day and no one gives a shit whether you have a 12 or 20 gauge. Now if you are hunting then you'll want a 12 but 20's are fun to shoot and a lot better when shooting trap and skeet.

buy a double barrel 10g and some 3.5" magnum OOO buck rounds to go with it...

that'll blow a hole in an elephants ass

Only if you plan on going on an African safari would I find that useful... ha. I guess it would be pretty cool to show your friends. Hell, you could record yourself blowing one of their legs off and then show it to everyone, 20 bucks says no one ever tries to break into your house... ever

my buddy uses one for deer:violent-smiley-045:

gandermountain ad this weekend for a new 870 w/ 26 barrel $249.99 with a $30 mail in rebate for a total cost of $219.00....$400 in cali..that sucks..

I'm a certified 3 weapon Combat Master (means I spent enough thousands of dollars on training and I can shoot under pressure) and I've done my share of training for families/women/cops/military (meaning I train them... and yes I will train you if you're willing to pay).

First, shotguns make less than ideal home defense weapons. They do have to be aimed at the ranges you'll see indoors, they explode walls if you miss (killing whoever is on the other side) and there are unavoidable tactical problems with using such a long gun inside a structure.

In my experience, the best weapon is one you feel comfortable using to murder an intruder when you're nearly asleep, completely naked, very scared and confused. Typically this means the best gun is something instinctive to use, not overly powerful, that can be point-aimed at 20ft distances, can support +P+ frangible ammo (MagSafe, Glaser Blue, Glaser Silver, BeeSafe) without damage to the weapon.

This being the case, the gun I would equip a new owner with as a defense and plinking gun would be a Ruger GP100 based .357mag (NO STAINLESS FOR HOME DEFENSE WEAPONS unless you live in a swamp or the tropics). You can use .38special ammo (cheap as hell) for fun, train with inexpensive full power 357 loads, and defend/hunt with the frangible loads I listed above.

It is imperitive that you be competently trained. A gun used for home defense is more likely to cause collateral damage than to smoke an intruder. It's a problem of tactical awareness meeting abject terror and accuracy suffers as a result. When you're properly trained you'll fight how you trained.

Lastly, I have seen it proved numerous times but it bears repeating here:
During a crisis you will NOT rise to the occasion but you WILL default to your level of training. I've experienced it personally, and seen it live enough times to say it's 100% true.

In auto pistols, glock is home defense. No buttons, levers or BS... just a really good gun that shoots every time and hold a lot of bullets. I do not recommend an auto for a home defense gun. I have lots of them but I still use a wheel gun for home defense (my wife uses an M1 Carbine with 30 rounds of my handloads using frangible loads... she doesn't like the muzzle blast of the .357 and her place is behind the front lines unless I'm gone).

well said redneck...

but with that in mind...I am a 4th generation american blue blooded couch potato. I dont like moving unless i go to get food or poop. if i lose the tv remote i call 911. thats why i decided to have my house booby trapped with pressure mines and thin wire connected to grenade pins half pulled out. there is no way on gods green earth im goin got use my free american energy to pull a trigger or even load a gun let alone aim it. why bother when i can have a large explosive device do it for me. now only if i wasn't confined to this 3 square foot area filled the smells of poop, urine and Dr. pepper i'd by ok. im working on a solution to hover my fat ass around my house without blowing myself up. ill let you guys know how it goes from here on out.:omghi2u:

apparently you missed the part where i said don't tell me to get a 20 gauge, since i've already decided on a 12 (if i end up getting a shotgun).
Also i live in a very big house with lots of open space, so wielding a shotgun around in it wouldn't be difficult. Also my parents are much more comfortable with me having a shotgun in the house than they are with a handgun. (i know that doesn't make much sense since a shotgun has such destructive potential) And the price was 370 brand new but i know they will lower it or throw in some freebies if i'm actually buying and am not just looking. I'm still not sure what i want to get, i am going to the range next week to fire off some different size handguns and a couple different brands of shotgun and will narrow my choices down from there

Greg and R3dn3ck you have been alot of help, everyone else go away.

Hmm, a Glock in .40 or .45 will kill you just as dead as that S&W. :shrug:

You said don't tell you to get a 20 because you aren't too pussy to handle a 12. What I was saying is that no one cares if a 12's recoil hurts your shoulder, even though it shouldn't. I wasn't trying to insult your manly-ness if that's how you measure it...

no i didn't take it as an insult. I was just slightly annoyed that i said dont say get a 20 gauge and someone did anyway LOL. it's all good bro.

I still preffer my .20 over my .12 for bird hunting...makes it a little funner... .20 will still put a pretty little mark on your shoulder..

I bash Glocks for the fact that I don't like the feeling of them...

And I bash 9mms hardcore... because they are overrated and every rapper and his retarded mom are like "9 can keel someone yo"....all i have to say is...no shit and a .22 can do the same thing.

Automatics aren't reliable for home defence imo, any automatic can mess up and jam..which is why I have my blackhawk with .357 loads under the bed, and the .45 auto in the safe..

I teach a "Refuse to be a Victim" class for women and the elderly/disabled. As part of that class I have the students do a call and response. We read through some selected news clippings of people like them using guns for defense and analyze the situation in their own cases blah blah blah. Every few minutes I'll randomly holler out "What kind of gun stops fights?" and they chant back "The gun is a tool and any one will do. I am the weapon so I stop the fight."

There is no best caliber. That's a universal fact. Pump up your favorite caliber as much as you want, use the hottest round you can find... won't matter. What wins a gun fight is timing. Whoever was the first to decide to kill the other guy and really commit to that action path will generally prevail. To assure victory you need the following in order of importance: Commitment, accuracy, tools, a just reason. Notice speed, weapon power, weapon type etc... aren't even mentioned. Simply have the weapon, be committed to the act and you will usually prevail. After that it's all training in cover and concealment, tactical and strategic maneuvers and volume of fire on target that picks the winner.

My point is, don't look to any caliber as better than another. That's how people get killed. When you assign some tactical value to the width of your bullet you assign power to it that it does not have. You have all the power. Put the bullet in the center of mass and continue doing so until the threat has been converted to non-combatant status.

Finally... fwiw, I'm a .45 auto user. 9mm is overrated by the ignorant and underrated by the public. SnTBakos and I totally agree on one thing... a .22 will keel da fooz just as well as a 9mm/.40/.45/.44/etc.. All you have to do is put the bullet in the center of mass, rinse and repeat.

^ Precisely. I learn more and more about the 'neck every day :D