gotta keep my baby clean..but how?

Phantom1313 · 03-15-2005, 04:25 PM

alright, for those of u who dont know, i've got an 01 mustang in black, my problem is kepein my baby clean between washes, and i dont have the time to wash her more than once every 2 weeks, so im wondeirng what the best was/wax combo would be to keep her lookin clena for as long as possible....any input here will be much appriciated...thanks...

WaterDR · 03-15-2005, 04:54 PM

As a black Mustang owner, I can relate. I am a really good detailer and I think I can give you some sound advice.

Since the car sounds like a dd and you are short on time, I would definately suggest that you stick with polymers. They will hold-up better and the car will stay cleaner longer. Also, teflon based products are great too.

1 - Wash the car really well using some dish soap or a good cleaner such as Maguires. (don't use the dish soap between waxes, only when starting from scratch)

2 - Use Maguires Step 1 paint cleaner, followed by the Step 2 paint sealer. Simply follow the instructions. Use a nice micro-fiber towel for buffing and a good micro-fiber applicator if you can find one.

3 - Now, instead of buying Maguires Strep 3, use two coats of Tech Wax from Maguires.

4 - The car will now look amazing.

5 - In between waxes, you have a few options. The easiest is to dry the car with some Eagle One Wax as You Dry. Or, you guy use the Maguires NXT Booster Wax, but it is harder to apply. The Eagle one takes no additional time beyond just drying the car.

6 - Teflon based products will last longer than the NXT, but may not look quite as good.

I have many other methods, but this seems like a good option for you.

Phantom1313 · 03-15-2005, 05:26 PM

i just had her washed today, so im going to probably wash her again this weekend and try your method...thanks a ton man, i love my car,but black just looks bad when it's ugly, thanks again

WaterDR · 03-15-2005, 06:17 PM

If you really want to make it "pop" when you are done. Put a coat or two of the best carnuba you can find over the top of the NXT. I use P21S. The stuff goes on like butter and leaves no residue because it is the purest grade of carnuba you can get. The surface of the car will be soo slick, you won't be able to lean on it and the black will be deep, like a gelcoat.

P21S is pricey at $35 a can, and is imported from Germany, but worth every penny. It is not very durable, however, which is why I suggested putting it on top of the NXT (which I have done) if you decide to use at all.

You can buy it from autopia.org

Phantom1313 · 03-15-2005, 08:58 PM

damn, that sounds nice, i'll look around for the best carnuba wax i cna find, it will take alot of time to put it all on but it will look freakin sexy when it's done...oh random question, how often should i wax my car? obviously everytime i wash it would be a bit excessive...and i heared using wax too often can acctually mess up ur paint or clear coat or sumthin...

tedinde · 03-15-2005, 09:43 PM

Black is tough. My 2002 F150 4x4 is black, Its hard as hell to keep clean and 2 times as much area to clean than my mustang. I usually end up taking it to the good car wash which is $16, with the hand drying and vacuuming and quick detailing.

My Gt stays in the garage, this is the first white mustang ive owned. White is easy as can be to keep clean. Even with a little road dirt it doesnt show. Hose it off and go.

WaterDR · 03-15-2005, 09:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phantom1313

damn, that sounds nice, i'll look around for the best carnuba wax i cna find, it will take alot of time to put it all on but it will look freakin sexy when it's done...oh random question, how often should i wax my car? obviously everytime i wash it would be a bit excessive...and i heared using wax too often can acctually mess up ur paint or clear coat or sumthin...

If your car is clean and you use clean rags and a wax with NO cleaners in it, there is zero risk of damaging or removing the clear coat.

Everytime you run something over the surface of the paint, there is a chance of a scratch, it's just a matter of being smart.

My car gets put away for the winter. Here is what I did before the spring:

1 - Wash with dish soap
2 - Claybar entire car
3 - Use Sonus Paint Cleaner and buff to a shine
4 - Use one coat Klasse AIO cleaner and acrylic sealant
5 - One coat of Klasse Acrylic Glaze on entire car including glass. Buff till your arms fall off.
6 - P21S. The first 3 - 4 coats I wait for it to dry and then buff. Then the next 3-4 coats get buffed while wet, one small section at a time. Each full coat only takes about 15 minutes. On my hood, I have about 10 coats of the P21S.

So in all, it's a 16 step process. The car simply looks wet! The shine is absolutely silly.

Depending on my mood, once I start driving the car, I will wash it about 2 - 4 times per month. I will use maguires quick detailer after washing and hit it with a coat of P21S if time permits. I use the quick detailer to help dry the car and because it is carnuba to help maintain the 8 coats of carnuba that I applied over the winter (lol).

You should re-wax your car whenever it stops beading (if you use carnuba) or sheeting (if you use polymers). That is a sign that the product has worn-off. Also, rub your finger across the paint. it should glide across the surface and not make a squeaking sound.

Stevoneo · 03-15-2005, 10:38 PM

mine is silver, not easy to see when dirty. Darn pollen has droped on my car though, piss me off. now i got yellow on her

tedinde · 03-16-2005, 12:33 AM

I have some spots on my hood of my Black truck, spots and in deep. I tested trying to get them out with polishing compound, and even fired up the 10" buffer, I cant seem to get these spots out. Ill post some pics tomorrow if anyone has any ideas on what to do.. I dont have a clue what these little specs are.

Phantom1313 · 03-16-2005, 06:48 AM

if they are just specs on the surface of ur car, not the acctuall paint, then u may just ahve some hard to clean off dirt....dang i cant wait to go buy all this stuff and make my baby shine, but that will have to wait till the weekend at the earliest...thanks guys

WaterDR · 03-16-2005, 07:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tedinde

I have some spots on my hood of my Black truck, spots and in deep. I tested trying to get them out with polishing compound, and even fired up the 10" buffer, I cant seem to get these spots out. Ill post some pics tomorrow if anyone has any ideas on what to do.. I dont have a clue what these little specs are.

That could be a lot of things, even acid rain damage. You may have to just live with it.

If you can find a small spot on the surface of the car. Use some paint cleaner on the spot to get the wax off or even some wax remover. Then hit that small spot with some diluted vinegar. They might be hard water spots, and the vinegar is a weak acid which might get rid of them. Give that a try. It should not hurt the paint at all and will still take lot of elbow grease.

The best way to eliminate hard water sports or acid rain spots is through prevention. Maintaining a good coat of wax is the best defence.

BTW, my car is 5 years old and have 55 k on it. The paint is far from perfect. Making the black a nice deep color and having that thing "pop" will go a long way towards not seeing these other issues.

TonyStangs · 03-17-2005, 06:45 PM

is it really THAT bad for the paint to just have your car washed at a car wash?

WaterDR · 03-17-2005, 06:47 PM

I think it depends on the wash.

TonyStangs · 03-17-2005, 06:52 PM

what do you mean, cause i REALLY dont wanna harm my baby but i just never have time to wash it myself , but if the car wash scratches the paint then obviously ill MAKE time to wash her

WaterDR · 03-17-2005, 08:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TonyStangs

what do you mean, cause i REALLY dont wanna harm my baby but i just never have time to wash it myself , but if the car wash scratches the paint then obviously ill MAKE time to wash her

A clean car wash is fine, and dirty one is not. Here is my golden rule:

Avoid coin operated washes if you plan on using the brush. I fyou are gonna use your own sponge, then that is fine.

No gas station washes.

Touchless washes that just spray water and don't actually touch the car are fine.

Any place that is expensive and you see a lot of high-end cars go through may be a safe bet.

I can hand wach my car from start to finnish including drying in about 15 minutes.

Phantom1313 · 03-18-2005, 07:57 AM

so u say no gas station car washes, but the place i got my car washed last time has a "touchless" carwash system, the only time anyone touches ur car is to get the wheels, and dry it off...is this ok? im goin to assume so, since they ususally do a good job, and alot of people i kno take their cars there....but i just wanna make sure...

WaterDR · 03-18-2005, 12:38 PM

I was mostly referring to those ones that are $5.00 with a tank of gas. Use your best judgement and you will be fine. Keep in mind that everytime something rubs the surface of the car, you risk scratches.

Phantom1313 · 03-18-2005, 06:57 PM

yeah the wash i get costs 8.95 normally...that's the least xpensive one too, they go up to like 30 or 40 bucks....

MattJ · 03-19-2005, 01:37 PM

I clayed and waxed mine today. Nice and smooth.
:icon_flow

USMCstang · 04-11-2005, 08:52 AM

For longevity...I say go with NXT. Here's an example, followed by details:

Now for the details.

These pictures were taken 3 weeks ago. NXT wax was applied in October of last year, 10,000 miles were put on the car since then, daily-driven, on Ohio winter roads (salt, slush, and just about any other stuff you can think of). There are a total of 105,000 miles on the car. These results are after NOTHING but a hand wash with Meguiars deep crystal car wash and using a microfiber towel to dry....nothing else. I hadn't clayed or anything yet. To give you an idea of the grime that was on there, there's this pic from my brake install:

Not the greatest pic...but it gives you the idea of how grimy it can get....I spray it once a week in the winter...but it doesn't help much on these roads.

I gotta say...I've never seen the car look better after a long, cold winter and just a hand wash :glasses2:

Sleeper Stang96 · 04-11-2005, 09:20 AM

Mike you are the man....I cant wait to get the new body parts, get it painted, and have it actually start looking good!

USMCstang · 04-11-2005, 10:39 AM

Just like anything else...maintaining it is all in the prep work...did you see this thread over on the depot that I posted?

Quote:

Originally posted by usmcstang
Well...someday it'll warm up here. Here's my plan for spring cleaning, if anyone has anything to add to the process, let me know. I want to make sure I'm not forgetting anything or using the wrong products.

Remove license plates, floor mats, all seats, spolier, and trash from car.
Vacuum interior/ trunk, shampoo (need a suggestion for good shampoo brand here), vacuum again
drink a Guiness while carpet is drying
Clean and preserve the leather (steering wheel) with Meguiar's system
detail all the plastic with Meguiars NXT Protectant
Febreeze and throw a new air freshener in
clean interior windows, first with steam cleaner, then with windex & 000grade steel wool, then windex and newspaper
Warm up engine for about 5 mins
Shut off engine, cover harnesses/ coil packs, with Aluminum foil, remove air filter and cover intake openings as well
Clean and oil air filter with K&N service kit
Simple green the engine bay, use hose, then Scunci steam cleaner for final "rinse"
reinstall air filter
Run car for a bit to aid in engine drying
drink a beer
detail engine with NXT protectant
Wash outside with Dawn dish soap and real wool wash mitt, to strip old wax
Go over problem areas with bug and tar cleaner (need a suggestion on brand here)
Rinse car again with Mr. Clean auto dry
blow water out of all cracks and crevices with an air compressor
dry car with Turtle wax miracle towel
drink a beer
Clay car with the Blue clay magic bar and their "lubricating spray"
Go over car with shop light at an agnle to look for scratches/ swirls. Fix scratches with Meguiar's Scratch X
wash car again with dawn, dry with miracle towel
detail the trim with NXT protectant
Clean windows/ mirrors with windex, first with 000 grade steel wool, then final polish with newspaper
RainX windows
Glaze car 3-5 times with Meguiar's no. 7 show car Glaze and microfiber cloth
drink a beer
Seal the glaze with Meguiar's NXT Paste wax...2 coats
Drink a beer
Since the body is done...remove the wheels/ tires and clean them inside and out with wheel cleaner (need a brand), then clay, then glaze, then polish (they're clearcoated)
detail tires with Turtle wax tire wax gel, install wheels, tires.
Clean leather seats with Meguiar's system, reinstall (if I still have my leather seats instead of my new ones
Go over the car with a shop light at an angle to look for any missed spots. Use Q-tips or soft bristled toothbrush if need be around joints/ trim
drink final beer in Six pack
Wonder where my entire weekend went

Everything is done by hand...I'm thinking about a porter cable polisher, but I think I'll just do better by hand. I'm not interested in speed (obviously), but more quality and attention to detail. The stuff listed in bold I am open to suggestion on as far as products. I also want to know if you guys use any different sequence or techniques. Sorry for the long list...my fingers hurt now. :thumb:

Once you do all that crap...maintenance is a snap...wash, dry, quick detail

Sleeper Stang96 · 04-11-2005, 10:52 AM

only a six pack? You might be older than me, but you have a lot to learn...then again, that might be why your car looks better than mine, but I usually get a good view of the under carriage after I fall over! J/K I dont mix my car with alcohol unless I dont plan on going anywhere

03-15-2005, 04:25 PM	#1 (permalink)
Phantom1313 i <3 mustangs Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: California Posts: 70	gotta keep my baby clean..but how? alright, for those of u who dont know, i've got an 01 mustang in black, my problem is kepein my baby clean between washes, and i dont have the time to wash her more than once every 2 weeks, so im wondeirng what the best was/wax combo would be to keep her lookin clena for as long as possible....any input here will be much appriciated...thanks...

03-15-2005, 04:54 PM	#2 (permalink)
WaterDR Administrator Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 6,363	As a black Mustang owner, I can relate. I am a really good detailer and I think I can give you some sound advice. Since the car sounds like a dd and you are short on time, I would definately suggest that you stick with polymers. They will hold-up better and the car will stay cleaner longer. Also, teflon based products are great too. 1 - Wash the car really well using some dish soap or a good cleaner such as Maguires. (don't use the dish soap between waxes, only when starting from scratch) 2 - Use Maguires Step 1 paint cleaner, followed by the Step 2 paint sealer. Simply follow the instructions. Use a nice micro-fiber towel for buffing and a good micro-fiber applicator if you can find one. 3 - Now, instead of buying Maguires Strep 3, use two coats of Tech Wax from Maguires. 4 - The car will now look amazing. 5 - In between waxes, you have a few options. The easiest is to dry the car with some Eagle One Wax as You Dry. Or, you guy use the Maguires NXT Booster Wax, but it is harder to apply. The Eagle one takes no additional time beyond just drying the car. 6 - Teflon based products will last longer than the NXT, but may not look quite as good. I have many other methods, but this seems like a good option for you. __________________ Black 2000 GT Vert: Novi-2000 with Intercooler (375rwhp @ 9 psi); Tune by Kauffmans; Roush 380R Body kit; Steeda Subframes; Steeda Strut Tower Support; Deep Dish Bullets; FRPP 4:10's; SCT 4 Position Chip with four custom tunes; Steeda CAI; C&L Pleum; BBK 75 TB; SLP Loudmouth; SLP Catted X-Pipe; Bullitt Suspension; UPR Conrol Arms; Focus Fuel Pump My Car My Email

03-15-2005, 05:26 PM	#3 (permalink)
Phantom1313 i <3 mustangs Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: California Posts: 70	thanks i just had her washed today, so im going to probably wash her again this weekend and try your method...thanks a ton man, i love my car,but black just looks bad when it's ugly, thanks again

03-15-2005, 06:17 PM	#4 (permalink)
WaterDR Administrator Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 6,363	If you really want to make it "pop" when you are done. Put a coat or two of the best carnuba you can find over the top of the NXT. I use P21S. The stuff goes on like butter and leaves no residue because it is the purest grade of carnuba you can get. The surface of the car will be soo slick, you won't be able to lean on it and the black will be deep, like a gelcoat. P21S is pricey at $35 a can, and is imported from Germany, but worth every penny. It is not very durable, however, which is why I suggested putting it on top of the NXT (which I have done) if you decide to use at all. You can buy it from autopia.org __________________ Black 2000 GT Vert: Novi-2000 with Intercooler (375rwhp @ 9 psi); Tune by Kauffmans; Roush 380R Body kit; Steeda Subframes; Steeda Strut Tower Support; Deep Dish Bullets; FRPP 4:10's; SCT 4 Position Chip with four custom tunes; Steeda CAI; C&L Pleum; BBK 75 TB; SLP Loudmouth; SLP Catted X-Pipe; Bullitt Suspension; UPR Conrol Arms; Focus Fuel Pump My Car My Email

03-15-2005, 08:58 PM	#5 (permalink)
Phantom1313 i <3 mustangs Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: California Posts: 70	ooh that sounds sweet damn, that sounds nice, i'll look around for the best carnuba wax i cna find, it will take alot of time to put it all on but it will look freakin sexy when it's done...oh random question, how often should i wax my car? obviously everytime i wash it would be a bit excessive...and i heared using wax too often can acctually mess up ur paint or clear coat or sumthin...

03-15-2005, 09:43 PM	#6 (permalink)
tedinde Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Bear Delaware Posts: 220	Black is tough. My 2002 F150 4x4 is black, Its hard as hell to keep clean and 2 times as much area to clean than my mustang. I usually end up taking it to the good car wash which is $16, with the hand drying and vacuuming and quick detailing. My Gt stays in the garage, this is the first white mustang ive owned. White is easy as can be to keep clean. Even with a little road dirt it doesnt show. Hose it off and go. __________________ 1997GT SOHC, PI Heads,intake, SCT 4 bank, UPR CAI Zex Nitrous system 125 hp shot,Steeda Tri-AX March Underdrive pullies,2 1/2 O/R Pipe, Magnaflow Catbacks,Mac Upper and lower Control arms,5 speed 4.10 Gears,31 spline, Nitto 555 drag radials Spinning

03-15-2005, 10:38 PM	#8 (permalink)
Stevoneo Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Virginia Beach, VA Posts: 598	mine is silver, not easy to see when dirty. Darn pollen has droped on my car though, piss me off. now i got yellow on her __________________ 2004 Mach 1 - New Baby Numbers Coming Soon 2001 Mustang GT - In Mustang Heaven 399.65 RWHP 384 Torque

03-16-2005, 12:33 AM	#9 (permalink)
tedinde Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Bear Delaware Posts: 220	I have some spots on my hood of my Black truck, spots and in deep. I tested trying to get them out with polishing compound, and even fired up the 10" buffer, I cant seem to get these spots out. Ill post some pics tomorrow if anyone has any ideas on what to do.. I dont have a clue what these little specs are. __________________ 1997GT SOHC, PI Heads,intake, SCT 4 bank, UPR CAI Zex Nitrous system 125 hp shot,Steeda Tri-AX March Underdrive pullies,2 1/2 O/R Pipe, Magnaflow Catbacks,Mac Upper and lower Control arms,5 speed 4.10 Gears,31 spline, Nitto 555 drag radials Spinning

03-16-2005, 06:48 AM	#10 (permalink)
Phantom1313 i <3 mustangs Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: California Posts: 70	are they specs in ur paint or just on the surface? if they are just specs on the surface of ur car, not the acctuall paint, then u may just ahve some hard to clean off dirt....dang i cant wait to go buy all this stuff and make my baby shine, but that will have to wait till the weekend at the earliest...thanks guys

03-17-2005, 06:45 PM	#12 (permalink)
TonyStangs Mustang Guru Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: New York Posts: 272	is it really THAT bad for the paint to just have your car washed at a car wash? __________________ --__-- My 2002 Mustang GT --__-- - Urethane Cobra R Front Bumper - K&N Air Charger Intake - Mach 1 Grille Delete and Lip Spoiler (Painted To Match) - Side View Mirrors (Painted To Match) - 18x9/18x10 Chrome Saleen Wheels w/ Nitto Tires - Brembo Drilled/Slotted Rotors - Steeda Tri-Ax Short Shifter - Brake Calipers (Painted To Match) - Eibach Pro-Kit Springs - Tokico Struts/Shocks - Magnaflow Magnapack Cat-Back - MAC Off-Road H-Pipe - SCT Superchips XCaliber Tuner

03-17-2005, 06:47 PM	#13 (permalink)
WaterDR Administrator Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 6,363	I think it depends on the wash. __________________ Black 2000 GT Vert: Novi-2000 with Intercooler (375rwhp @ 9 psi); Tune by Kauffmans; Roush 380R Body kit; Steeda Subframes; Steeda Strut Tower Support; Deep Dish Bullets; FRPP 4:10's; SCT 4 Position Chip with four custom tunes; Steeda CAI; C&L Pleum; BBK 75 TB; SLP Loudmouth; SLP Catted X-Pipe; Bullitt Suspension; UPR Conrol Arms; Focus Fuel Pump My Car My Email

03-17-2005, 06:52 PM	#14 (permalink)
TonyStangs Mustang Guru Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: New York Posts: 272	what do you mean, cause i REALLY dont wanna harm my baby but i just never have time to wash it myself , but if the car wash scratches the paint then obviously ill MAKE time to wash her __________________ --__-- My 2002 Mustang GT --__-- - Urethane Cobra R Front Bumper - K&N Air Charger Intake - Mach 1 Grille Delete and Lip Spoiler (Painted To Match) - Side View Mirrors (Painted To Match) - 18x9/18x10 Chrome Saleen Wheels w/ Nitto Tires - Brembo Drilled/Slotted Rotors - Steeda Tri-Ax Short Shifter - Brake Calipers (Painted To Match) - Eibach Pro-Kit Springs - Tokico Struts/Shocks - Magnaflow Magnapack Cat-Back - MAC Off-Road H-Pipe - SCT Superchips XCaliber Tuner

03-18-2005, 07:57 AM	#16 (permalink)
Phantom1313 i <3 mustangs Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: California Posts: 70	k now im confused... so u say no gas station car washes, but the place i got my car washed last time has a "touchless" carwash system, the only time anyone touches ur car is to get the wheels, and dry it off...is this ok? im goin to assume so, since they ususally do a good job, and alot of people i kno take their cars there....but i just wanna make sure...

03-18-2005, 12:38 PM	#17 (permalink)
WaterDR Administrator Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 6,363	I was mostly referring to those ones that are $5.00 with a tank of gas. Use your best judgement and you will be fine. Keep in mind that everytime something rubs the surface of the car, you risk scratches. __________________ Black 2000 GT Vert: Novi-2000 with Intercooler (375rwhp @ 9 psi); Tune by Kauffmans; Roush 380R Body kit; Steeda Subframes; Steeda Strut Tower Support; Deep Dish Bullets; FRPP 4:10's; SCT 4 Position Chip with four custom tunes; Steeda CAI; C&L Pleum; BBK 75 TB; SLP Loudmouth; SLP Catted X-Pipe; Bullitt Suspension; UPR Conrol Arms; Focus Fuel Pump My Car My Email

03-18-2005, 06:57 PM	#18 (permalink)
Phantom1313 i <3 mustangs Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: California Posts: 70	mmm k yeah the wash i get costs 8.95 normally...that's the least xpensive one too, they go up to like 30 or 40 bucks....

03-19-2005, 01:37 PM	#19 (permalink)
MattJ Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Racine, WI Posts: 10,243	I clayed and waxed mine today. Nice and smooth. :icon_flow __________________ 2001 Mustang GT Premium - Mineral Grey

04-11-2005, 08:52 AM	#20 (permalink)
USMCstang Secretary of Defense Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Akron, OH...5 Mins from Summit Racing Posts: 355	For longevity...I say go with NXT. Here's an example, followed by details: Now for the details. These pictures were taken 3 weeks ago. NXT wax was applied in October of last year, 10,000 miles were put on the car since then, daily-driven, on Ohio winter roads (salt, slush, and just about any other stuff you can think of). There are a total of 105,000 miles on the car. These results are after NOTHING but a hand wash with Meguiars deep crystal car wash and using a microfiber towel to dry....nothing else. I hadn't clayed or anything yet. To give you an idea of the grime that was on there, there's this pic from my brake install: Not the greatest pic...but it gives you the idea of how grimy it can get....I spray it once a week in the winter...but it doesn't help much on these roads. I gotta say...I've never seen the car look better after a long, cold winter and just a hand wash :glasses2: __________________ ~Mike 98 GT 4R70W Buckeye Stangs - Ohio Based Mustang Enthusiasts

04-11-2005, 09:20 AM	#21 (permalink)
Sleeper Stang96 Bubba Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Long Island NY Posts: 127	Mike you are the man....I cant wait to get the new body parts, get it painted, and have it actually start looking good! __________________ Women and Mustangs, one day I hope to figure one of them out! M/M 7782

04-11-2005, 10:52 AM	#23 (permalink)
Sleeper Stang96 Bubba Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Long Island NY Posts: 127	only a six pack? You might be older than me, but you have a lot to learn...then again, that might be why your car looks better than mine, but I usually get a good view of the under carriage after I fall over! J/K I dont mix my car with alcohol unless I dont plan on going anywhere __________________ Women and Mustangs, one day I hope to figure one of them out! M/M 7782