Anyone intrested in 5.4L swaps, in here. Need you to opine. - Page 92

2kstang · 10-08-2007, 12:35 PM

Hey guys! I am new to the boards but not the mustang community.. I have spent the better part of a week reading through all of this post's 92 pages and let me say I am now more than intrigued. I want to start on the swap ASAP in order to get rid of an old tired 130k+ miles 4.6L! My first question, and possibly one of my few, most having been already answered from my readings

would be where to look for a block or complete 3 valve engine relatively inexpensively besides the obvious forum classifieds and ebay?

2Eighty1 · 10-08-2007, 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2kstang

Hey guys! I am new to the boards but not the mustang community.. I have spent the better part of a week reading through all of this post's 92 pages and let me say I am now more than intrigued. I want to start on the swap ASAP in order to get rid of an old tired 130k+ miles 4.6L! My first question, and possibly one of my few, most having been already answered from my readings

would be where to look for a block or complete 3 valve engine relatively inexpensively besides the obvious forum classifieds and ebay?

car-part.com is a national junkyard search.

I found my block listed there and got in touch with the shop that listed it. The rest is history.

Oh - and welcome!

r3dn3ck · 10-08-2007, 01:37 PM

I'd use a 20ga. shotgun bore brush (phosphor-bronze) and a 18" rifle cleaning rod to get down in the cooling jackets. Use a little bit of CLR in a squirt bottle and let it soak for a few minutes. It works at the molecule level so it won't eat a hole in there unless you let it sit for a very long time.

Rinse liberally with water and repeat till happy. Once you're done make sure you rinse it very well. You don't want that stuff to sit in there for days on end.

2Eighty1 · 10-08-2007, 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by r3dn3ck

I'd use a 20ga. shotgun bore brush (phosphor-bronze) and a 18" rifle cleaning rod to get down in the cooling jackets. Use a little bit of CLR in a squirt bottle and let it soak for a few minutes. It works at the molecule level so it won't eat a hole in there unless you let it sit for a very long time.

Rinse liberally with water and repeat till happy. Once you're done make sure you rinse it very well. You don't want that stuff to sit in there for days on end.

Without your knowledge, the world would cease to exist.

Thank you sir, I can see a few new items on my shopping list this weekend.

r3dn3ck · 10-08-2007, 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2kstang

Hey guys! I am new to the boards but not the mustang community.. I have spent the better part of a week reading through all of this post's 92 pages and let me say I am now more than intrigued. I want to start on the swap ASAP in order to get rid of an old tired 130k+ miles 4.6L! My first question, and possibly one of my few, most having been already answered from my readings

would be where to look for a block or complete 3 valve engine relatively inexpensively besides the obvious forum classifieds and ebay?

I found a pair of engines on craigslist. One was mostly trashed but a good mock up block for 80 bucks from intake to oil pan. the other was the one I'm installing and it was just in need of a rod bearing (got fully built anyway). Got that one for 550 complete. Both came off craigslist.org.

car-part.com is the best other source unless you want a kar-kraft.com motor.

2Eighty1 · 10-08-2007, 02:35 PM

I forgot you can try GreenLeaf or Greenway I forget what its called. Parts direct from Ford parts sources, but expencive for what you get. Google them and you will find the site.

2Eighty1 · 10-08-2007, 02:45 PM

Hey R3d - what do you think of this for those pesky water jackets ?

http://www.walmart.com/catalog/produ...uct_id=4939699

Or is that a little overkill ?

2kstang · 10-08-2007, 03:10 PM

Ok guys I found a guy in my area selling a 5.4 2v with 130k miles.. how much do u think I should offer him?

2Eighty1 · 10-08-2007, 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2kstang

Ok guys I found a guy in my area selling a 5.4 2v with 130k miles.. how much do u think I should offer him?

Full motor or shortblock ? Any problems, do you plan to rebuild it ?

For a full motor I'd say $400, go in low and see what he says. You might get lucky or you might have to come up into the $500 range.

My shortblock was $300ish i think, similar miles but it needed a rebuild.

2kstang · 10-08-2007, 03:54 PM

Thanks man.. Sounds good! He is parting out an explorer so I am going to try and get the complete engine off of him and I will be doing a rebuild as well

2Eighty1 · 10-08-2007, 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2kstang

Thanks man.. Sounds good! He is parting out an explorer so I am going to try and get the complete engine off of him and I will be doing a rebuild as well

Are you sure its a 5.4 ?

I've never seen a 5.4 in an explorer, only the F150 and expedition.

2kstang · 10-08-2007, 05:39 PM

Yep you got me there lol got my ford SUV's mixed up.. It is definitely a 5.4!

cdjnight · 10-08-2007, 08:37 PM

anyone made an adapter to put the 4.6 upper plenum on the 5.4 01-03 intake.

2Eighty1 · 10-08-2007, 08:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cdjnight

anyone made an adapter to put the 4.6 upper plenum on the 5.4 01-03 intake.

Negative.

The only adapters I have seen are to put the entire 2v intake (be it PI, bullitt, or otherwise) on a 5.4 but they aren't the greatest for flow.

I believe HPS just came out with their own version that are much better.

mean330 · 10-09-2007, 12:22 AM

I somehow managed to strip the threads on one of my chain tensioner bolt holes. What would be the best way to repair the threads since it's aluminum?

bassman97 · 10-09-2007, 07:36 AM

Helicoil or rethread it larger using a larger bolt to fasten the tensioner.

mean330 · 10-10-2007, 02:24 AM

Re-threading it larger did the trick, Thanks. Patriot stage 2's and comp xe270's are now installed. Tomorrow night the beast gets dropped back in the car. I have an appointment Saturday for a tune so hopefully I'll have some new numbers to share.

r3dn3ck · 10-10-2007, 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2Eighty1

Hey R3d - what do you think of this for those pesky water jackets ?

http://www.walmart.com/catalog/produ...uct_id=4939699

Or is that a little overkill ?

Looks like the perfect setup. Gets into all the holes and has the right brushes. The solvents are really good at cleaning up gunk too. Just make sure to wash it out really well... they're designed to absorb lead and copper and you don't want that left in an engine with bearings that have those metals in them.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2kstang

Ok guys I found a guy in my area selling a 5.4 2v with 130k miles.. how much do u think I should offer him?

130K = rebuild a good idea. I'd stop at 550 bucks complete from heads to oil pan including front cover and tensioner.

Quote:

Originally Posted by cdjnight

anyone made an adapter to put the 4.6 upper plenum on the 5.4 01-03 intake.

Won't work really... the shapes are so different and the intake is so tall taht it still pokes out the hood and it would choke the motor with the geometry needed to change from truck plenum to gt.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mean330

Re-threading it larger did the trick, Thanks. Patriot stage 2's and comp xe270's are now installed. Tomorrow night the beast gets dropped back in the car. I have an appointment Saturday for a tune so hopefully I'll have some new numbers to share.

W00t! can't wait to see them numbers.

2Eighty1 · 10-10-2007, 10:18 AM

I'm gonna order up that kit probably next week some time.

I just picked up a few big projects that I need to wrap up before I spent a bunch of time on the motor but things are going good so far !

mean330 · 10-13-2007, 02:08 PM

Well guys new numbers are in but i'm not real impressed. 290rwhp 340rwtq on a mustang dyno. I can't believe it didn't crack the 300 mark for hp. It definately pulls hard all the way up to 6k but still. I only gained about 30 horse .

r3dn3ck · 10-13-2007, 02:26 PM

Well I can offer some happy thoughts. You've nailed at least 340bhp and over 400btq out of 334 cubic inches. That's impressive by any standard. Now... without seeing your dyno graph I can't be too helpful but I'll bet dollars to donuts there's some intake restriction happening there. With 270's and patriot stage 2's you should be seeing a little more than that which leads me to the intake thought. Also.. did you install your cams straight up or advance or retard them at all? My simulator shows significant gains by retarding them 4 degrees (which kinda makes sense as it defeats the 4deg of advance that's ground into them out of the box to avoid PTV on 4.6's).

Post up a copy of your graph and I'll see what I can tell you. Also, if you have any data points logged from the run that'd be cool to. Do you know how much timing they have you running?

Oh yeah.. don't forget. you've got enough power just in tq (forget hp numbers for now) to really shock the hell out of a lot of ls1 and cobra pilots. You're well into Mach1 hp territory and the tq is going to magnify your hp numbers capabilities. Remember... hp is for show, tq is for go. Yes that's a drastic oversimplification but it works. I expect to see some 1/4mile numbers soon.

You can take the RX7 as an example. Plenty of hp, zero tq. Yes they're reasonably fast if they start from a roll but from a dead stop... you'll tear em up. I'll take tq anyday. You know a big rig tractor without a trailer can run 12's with only 400hp but with as much as 1400lbs or more of tq. From a cab that weighs in at like 12K lbs... that's not bad.

r3dn3ck · 10-13-2007, 02:53 PM

hey guys:

I just created a sticky in the dyno forum. Please see the thread and update with your info. If we can all keep it nice and free of babble then I think we'll have the authoritative source for 5.4 swap info on the web.

Also, if you guys know peeps from other boards with any manner of 5.4L powered mustang, please harass them to check in over here and post their numbers in they dyno sitcky in the dyno forum.

I'll be policing the new dyno thread and making sure it stays a reference thread instead of a chat thread. We can chat in this one...

Thanks for all of your help guys.

View Poll Results: What are your 5.4L swap plans?
Not swapping. You guys are nuts for trying.	0	0%
Not swapping but find the topic interesting.	0	0%
Thinking about doing the swap but not in the next year.	0	0%
Definitely going to do the swap in the next year or so.	0	0%
Doing it now. Looking for an engine or awaiting delivery.	0	0%
Doing it now. Already bought an engine.	0	0%
Done. Got my 5.4L and showin my tail lights to camaro's every day.	0	0%
Screw 5.4, I'm going 6.8L V10	0	0%
Voters: 0. You may not vote on this poll

10-08-2007, 12:35 PM	#2731 (permalink)
2kstang Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 4	Hey guys! I am new to the boards but not the mustang community.. I have spent the better part of a week reading through all of this post's 92 pages and let me say I am now more than intrigued. I want to start on the swap ASAP in order to get rid of an old tired 130k+ miles 4.6L! My first question, and possibly one of my few, most having been already answered from my readings would be where to look for a block or complete 3 valve engine relatively inexpensively besides the obvious forum classifieds and ebay? __________________ 2000 Mustang GT Last edited by 2kstang : 10-08-2007 at 01:08 PM.

10-08-2007, 02:35 PM	#2736 (permalink)
2Eighty1 Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 361	I forgot you can try GreenLeaf or Greenway I forget what its called. Parts direct from Ford parts sources, but expencive for what you get. Google them and you will find the site. __________________ 5.4L 3v '04 GT Buildup In Progress... For Photos visit: http://www.whitemustangregistry.com/...AGT-t1625.html

10-08-2007, 02:45 PM	#2737 (permalink)
2Eighty1 Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 361	Hey R3d - what do you think of this for those pesky water jackets ? http://www.walmart.com/catalog/produ...uct_id=4939699 Or is that a little overkill ? __________________ 5.4L 3v '04 GT Buildup In Progress... For Photos visit: http://www.whitemustangregistry.com/...AGT-t1625.html

10-08-2007, 03:10 PM	#2738 (permalink)
2kstang Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 4	Ok guys I found a guy in my area selling a 5.4 2v with 130k miles.. how much do u think I should offer him? __________________ 2000 Mustang GT

10-08-2007, 01:37 PM	#2733 (permalink)
r3dn3ck Wowbagger hates me too! Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Magrathea/California Posts: 7,018	I'd use a 20ga. shotgun bore brush (phosphor-bronze) and a 18" rifle cleaning rod to get down in the cooling jackets. Use a little bit of CLR in a squirt bottle and let it soak for a few minutes. It works at the molecule level so it won't eat a hole in there unless you let it sit for a very long time. Rinse liberally with water and repeat till happy. Once you're done make sure you rinse it very well. You don't want that stuff to sit in there for days on end.

10-08-2007, 03:54 PM	#2740 (permalink)
2kstang Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 4	Thanks man.. Sounds good! He is parting out an explorer so I am going to try and get the complete engine off of him and I will be doing a rebuild as well __________________ 2000 Mustang GT

10-08-2007, 05:39 PM	#2742 (permalink)
2kstang Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 4	Yep you got me there lol got my ford SUV's mixed up.. It is definitely a 5.4! __________________ 2000 Mustang GT

10-08-2007, 08:37 PM	#2743 (permalink)
cdjnight Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 117	anyone made an adapter to put the 4.6 upper plenum on the 5.4 01-03 intake. __________________ Momentum is everything till you drive off a cliff! 2003 Mustang GT, 5.4L Triton V8(LOL), Comp 270's gears and springs, Intercooled Precision T63, 42lb injectors, Flowmaster 3.5" Single Chamber, B&M Holeshot 3000, Racegate, Sniper Commando Tuning, Kenne Bell BAP,BG Mighty Sumo pump, MSD MOD6, LM1 wideband, Best e.t, 7.67@92mph in the 1/8th. on MT drag radials. No dyno tune yet. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DaJ2yQH1Ezs http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J1hiMJy3ezk

10-09-2007, 12:22 AM	#2745 (permalink)
mean330 Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Ohio Posts: 45	I somehow managed to strip the threads on one of my chain tensioner bolt holes. What would be the best way to repair the threads since it's aluminum? __________________ "horsepower sells cars but torque wins races"

10-09-2007, 07:36 AM	#2746 (permalink)
bassman97 blank Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: North Jersey Posts: 1,497	Helicoil or rethread it larger using a larger bolt to fasten the tensioner.

10-10-2007, 02:24 AM	#2747 (permalink)
mean330 Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Ohio Posts: 45	Re-threading it larger did the trick, Thanks. Patriot stage 2's and comp xe270's are now installed. Tomorrow night the beast gets dropped back in the car. I have an appointment Saturday for a tune so hopefully I'll have some new numbers to share. __________________ "horsepower sells cars but torque wins races"

10-10-2007, 10:18 AM	#2749 (permalink)
2Eighty1 Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 361	I'm gonna order up that kit probably next week some time. I just picked up a few big projects that I need to wrap up before I spent a bunch of time on the motor but things are going good so far ! __________________ 5.4L 3v '04 GT Buildup In Progress... For Photos visit: http://www.whitemustangregistry.com/...AGT-t1625.html

10-13-2007, 02:08 PM	#2750 (permalink)
mean330 Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Ohio Posts: 45	Well guys new numbers are in but i'm not real impressed. 290rwhp 340rwtq on a mustang dyno. I can't believe it didn't crack the 300 mark for hp. It definately pulls hard all the way up to 6k but still. I only gained about 30 horse . __________________ "horsepower sells cars but torque wins races"

10-13-2007, 02:26 PM	#2751 (permalink)
r3dn3ck Wowbagger hates me too! Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Magrathea/California Posts: 7,018	Well I can offer some happy thoughts. You've nailed at least 340bhp and over 400btq out of 334 cubic inches. That's impressive by any standard. Now... without seeing your dyno graph I can't be too helpful but I'll bet dollars to donuts there's some intake restriction happening there. With 270's and patriot stage 2's you should be seeing a little more than that which leads me to the intake thought. Also.. did you install your cams straight up or advance or retard them at all? My simulator shows significant gains by retarding them 4 degrees (which kinda makes sense as it defeats the 4deg of advance that's ground into them out of the box to avoid PTV on 4.6's). Post up a copy of your graph and I'll see what I can tell you. Also, if you have any data points logged from the run that'd be cool to. Do you know how much timing they have you running? Oh yeah.. don't forget. you've got enough power just in tq (forget hp numbers for now) to really shock the hell out of a lot of ls1 and cobra pilots. You're well into Mach1 hp territory and the tq is going to magnify your hp numbers capabilities. Remember... hp is for show, tq is for go. Yes that's a drastic oversimplification but it works. I expect to see some 1/4mile numbers soon. You can take the RX7 as an example. Plenty of hp, zero tq. Yes they're reasonably fast if they start from a roll but from a dead stop... you'll tear em up. I'll take tq anyday. You know a big rig tractor without a trailer can run 12's with only 400hp but with as much as 1400lbs or more of tq. From a cab that weighs in at like 12K lbs... that's not bad. Last edited by r3dn3ck : 10-13-2007 at 02:32 PM.

10-13-2007, 02:53 PM	#2752 (permalink)
r3dn3ck Wowbagger hates me too! Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Magrathea/California Posts: 7,018	hey guys: I just created a sticky in the dyno forum. Please see the thread and update with your info. If we can all keep it nice and free of babble then I think we'll have the authoritative source for 5.4 swap info on the web. Also, if you guys know peeps from other boards with any manner of 5.4L powered mustang, please harass them to check in over here and post their numbers in they dyno sitcky in the dyno forum. I'll be policing the new dyno thread and making sure it stays a reference thread instead of a chat thread. We can chat in this one... Thanks for all of your help guys.