Anyone intrested in 5.4L swaps, in here. Need you to opine. - Page 41

r3dn3ck · 02-26-2007, 06:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by myillwillinc

look at this someone sent to me off ebay.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/4-6-a...spagenameZWDVW

wonder if it's worth a crap.

nope. it's missing a bit of integration hardware... like a way to use an alternator, proper crossover tube, proof that it works at all, etc...

Purple racing has a pretty shabby rep to start with. besides... do you really want to buy something from Turkey via bank transfer.

Quote:

Originally Posted by stang671

Hey,
Does anyone have an idea what the most one could make NA...what's the most anyone one has seen or read about....2V4now what do you think you will be making...and R3d...thanks for that point about lbs/one point of compression...so your saying 91 ca can handle about 19. total..thanks for that insight i will keep that in mind...thanks for taking the time to read this....

there is a mathematical maximum of just about 460bhp which is about 390rwhp on a good day from well ported 2v heads. That would require a gnarly cam and very very very high rpm. With hogged out 4v heads the theoretical limit is over 630bhp. Al Pappito the current king of 5.4 4v's makes 500+ on his drag car NA. To get there takes similarly bad ass cams and wicked high rpm. Don't forget you'll need an intake in either case that can pull that kind of flow. Good luck.

For boost, build your engine to 9:1 compression and you can run a safe 14lbs or more with an intercooler. You'll have good low end torque and wild top end.

For those running 25lbs... damn! You're looking for what 650-700rwhp?

2V4NOW · 02-26-2007, 07:07 PM

somewhere in that neighborhood, i was thinking about low 6XXhp and 7XXtq..

the comp ratio on my motor i believe is 8:5:1

myillwillinc · 02-26-2007, 07:19 PM

i'm shooting for 400rwhp or as close as possible...

2V4NOW · 02-26-2007, 07:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by myillwillinc

i'm shooting for 400rwhp or as close as possible...

Whats on the mod list?

myillwillinc · 02-26-2007, 09:43 PM

bored .020"
comp cams 270's
bigger valves(1mm each)
port matched
electric water pump
steeda timing adjuster and underdrive pullies
frpp shortie headers and mac prochamber off road pipe, flowmasters 40's and dumps
90mm maf
39# injectors
c&l plenum
70mm frpp TB
k&n
adjustable fuel regulator
255lph pump
and a custom tune/chip

how close do u think i'll get?

2V4NOW · 02-26-2007, 10:07 PM

auto or manual? where did you get ur adj. fuel regulator, i need one??

myillwillinc · 02-26-2007, 10:16 PM

T-45 with a spec aluminum flywheel and stage 1 clutch.
got the adj. fuel reg from a buddy

2V4NOW · 02-26-2007, 10:47 PM

I think ur in the range of 330-350rwhp and 4XXtq with those mods... take it easy on that t45 though, it cant handle too much...

stang671 · 02-27-2007, 04:21 AM

that's great i can do that no problem r3d...now i'm debating if i want to take it and leave it at a shop or do it myself when i get back...the only thing i'm concerned about is installing the SC...i'm still thinking about that cent...instead of the KB...so i'm thinking about possiably ordering the short block and having it delievered while i'm gone and having the heads cleaned and all....that way when i get back i can just drop in then add the SC if it's not that hard...so i can be done with it by Thanksgivin..and R3d i'll be comin back to the Bay area at that time if we don't get extended with all this Bush sending more of US over seas and all...and also if i wait i can try and earn a little intrest

we all know how that intrest builds in the bank

....thanks for taking the time to read this....

SleepingGT · 02-27-2007, 04:45 AM

i'm a traitor...i'm putting in a 5.4 4v

anyone know the weight difference between the two, and does a 4v stick up higher than a 2v?

...i know LT's wont fit...but what about the midlength's they make for the 03/04 cobra? or does anyone know what kind of exhaust manifolds the 00 cobra R had? they should fit...provided it's possible to get ahold of them lol

r3dn3ck · 02-27-2007, 07:35 AM

sleeping... the heads weigh nearly double what the 2v do. Figure you'll be 200lbs heavier than stock up front. The 4v is just as tall as the 2v and there are better intakes available for 4v applications like the Reichard, Navigator, etc..

Midlength from Bassani should probably be something you can MAKE fit but they won't just out of the box... they're weld together so the special work isn't that bad. The 00'R had stock CAST IRON PI MANIFOLDS. Can you believe that crap.

SleepingGT · 02-27-2007, 07:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by r3dn3ck

sleeping... the heads weigh nearly double what the 2v do. Figure you'll be 200lbs heavier than stock up front. The 4v is just as tall as the 2v and there are better intakes available for 4v applications like the Reichard, Navigator, etc..

Midlength from Bassani should probably be something you can MAKE fit but they won't just out of the box... they're weld together so the special work isn't that bad. The 00'R had stock CAST IRON PI MANIFOLDS. Can you believe that crap.

no way? that sucks lol...i'm still waiting to find out exactly how much the swap will cost me...with the killer deal i found on the navi engine i really hope its monetarily feasible(if not i'll probably do a 2v swap myself..but 4v rewiring if i do it i will be paying someone to do the swap)

bassman97 · 02-27-2007, 09:27 AM

The '00 Cobra R had the PI exhaust logs!?! Imagine how power would be gained w/ FRPP 4V shortie headers. Why didn't Ford use the standard 4V manifold? Is the 2V PI version narrower or something?

r3dn3ck · 02-27-2007, 09:40 AM

the standard 4v manifold was used... PI was a typo that made it in from another thread... my bad. Nonetheless it was the cast iron log type and they suck.

the biggest reason to not use something better was space or rather a lack thereof. An old pal of mine had a 00 R that made 440rwhp with just a tune. Power gain with a shortie isn't impressive... if you can squeeze mids or long tubes in there then it starts getting interesting.

SleepingGT · 02-27-2007, 09:46 AM

thats what i was wondering about, how difficult would it be to beat some bassani midlengths in there

bassman97 · 02-27-2007, 10:32 AM

From what was said when Saleen330 was here, basically, the steering linkage got in the way. So some creativity will probably be needed to fix that problem and then they should fit.
That's what since it doen't make sense to put 2V logs on a 4V head.

r3dn3ck · 02-27-2007, 11:38 AM

or 4v logs on a 4v head...

SleepingGT · 02-27-2007, 09:19 PM

considering i never plan on going FI, i'm considering going stroker 4v instead so i can keep my "V6" hood and use lt's

anyone know the power difference between comparably modded 4.6 stroker vs 5.4 4v? both will be sprayed minimum 200 shot on forged internals

or if their is a 5.4 4v intake that allows me to keep the stock hood?

r3dn3ck · 02-28-2007, 07:15 AM

about 75hp and 100tq difference.

you have a good choice of intakes. If you stick with B heads and use a 96-98 cobra intake with Reichard plates you should see really good power output even with the Reichard 4v plates in place. hood clearance is going to be something you'll have to deal with. I'd start looking at a cobra R hood just in case. I don't know anyone personally who's got a 4v 5.4 other than Al Pappito and his car is pretty custom.

bassman97 · 02-28-2007, 07:50 AM

Why not go w/ the Cobra R/GT/GT500 heads? Kar Kraft has them for sale fully assembled. Ask Al if he could hook you up w/ a Cobra R intake and you'll be set. Then you're looking at a guarenteed 400 hp. However, if you don't have the money, yeah, what r3dn3ck said.

SleepingGT · 02-28-2007, 09:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by r3dn3ck

about 75hp and 100tq difference.

you have a good choice of intakes. If you stick with B heads and use a 96-98 cobra intake with Reichard plates you should see really good power output even with the Reichard 4v plates in place. hood clearance is going to be something you'll have to deal with. I'd start looking at a cobra R hood just in case. I don't know anyone personally who's got a 4v 5.4 other than Al Pappito and his car is pretty custom.

what are the power differences between well ported b heads and c heads?

r3dn3ck · 02-28-2007, 10:12 AM

negligable if you go by flow numbers. I recommend going with B heads so you can use some of the excellent intakes those years used. They aren't perfect by a long shot but they are very nice and flow big and they're factory ford so you shoudn't have much issue with smog techs twisting your berries over an aftermarket intake.

stang671 · 02-28-2007, 10:55 AM

How hard is it to install the cent...SC....and which cent..is the best one for this application...and should i leave it at a shop...or should i just order it and put it in when i get back...i will try to build it to the 9 compression then run it with 14lbs and hope fully with the meth..be able to run it on pump if that lb for compression theory works...but is it hard to install a SC (cent) and a 3-core cooler...i read it takes about 5-6hrs to install....thanks for taking the time to read this...

r3dn3ck · 02-28-2007, 11:20 AM

14lbs will work without methanol but I would use an aftercooler at 9:1. Still that's not uncommon on well tuned cars with 91 octane. Just aviod shady lookin gas stations. The blower is moderately difficult. I'd let a shop do it while you're out at sea.

I prefer the Novi2000 or the Vortech T-trim for the 5.4L. THey have enough flow to do the trick. As for cooler options... as big as you can fit. I'd talk to ATI (Procharger

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02-26-2007, 07:07 PM	#1202 (permalink)
2V4NOW Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 23	somewhere in that neighborhood, i was thinking about low 6XXhp and 7XXtq.. the comp ratio on my motor i believe is 8:5:1 __________________

02-26-2007, 07:19 PM	#1203 (permalink)
myillwillinc Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 655	i'm shooting for 400rwhp or as close as possible... __________________ 5.4 project in progress linky-> http://www.illwillinc.com/97mustang.htm T-Rods Coatings - Custom all the way.... http://www.illwillinc.com/

02-26-2007, 09:43 PM	#1205 (permalink)
myillwillinc Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 655	bored .020" comp cams 270's bigger valves(1mm each) port matched electric water pump steeda timing adjuster and underdrive pullies frpp shortie headers and mac prochamber off road pipe, flowmasters 40's and dumps 90mm maf 39# injectors c&l plenum 70mm frpp TB k&n adjustable fuel regulator 255lph pump and a custom tune/chip how close do u think i'll get? __________________ 5.4 project in progress linky-> http://www.illwillinc.com/97mustang.htm T-Rods Coatings - Custom all the way.... http://www.illwillinc.com/

02-26-2007, 10:07 PM	#1206 (permalink)
2V4NOW Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 23	auto or manual? where did you get ur adj. fuel regulator, i need one?? __________________

02-26-2007, 10:16 PM	#1207 (permalink)
myillwillinc Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 655	T-45 with a spec aluminum flywheel and stage 1 clutch. got the adj. fuel reg from a buddy __________________ 5.4 project in progress linky-> http://www.illwillinc.com/97mustang.htm T-Rods Coatings - Custom all the way.... http://www.illwillinc.com/

02-26-2007, 10:47 PM	#1208 (permalink)
2V4NOW Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 23	I think ur in the range of 330-350rwhp and 4XXtq with those mods... take it easy on that t45 though, it cant handle too much... __________________

02-27-2007, 04:21 AM	#1209 (permalink)
stang671 Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 61	that's great i can do that no problem r3d...now i'm debating if i want to take it and leave it at a shop or do it myself when i get back...the only thing i'm concerned about is installing the SC...i'm still thinking about that cent...instead of the KB...so i'm thinking about possiably ordering the short block and having it delievered while i'm gone and having the heads cleaned and all....that way when i get back i can just drop in then add the SC if it's not that hard...so i can be done with it by Thanksgivin..and R3d i'll be comin back to the Bay area at that time if we don't get extended with all this Bush sending more of US over seas and all...and also if i wait i can try and earn a little intrest we all know how that intrest builds in the bank ....thanks for taking the time to read this....

02-27-2007, 04:45 AM	#1210 (permalink)
SleepingGT Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 147	i'm a traitor...i'm putting in a 5.4 4v anyone know the weight difference between the two, and does a 4v stick up higher than a 2v? ...i know LT's wont fit...but what about the midlength's they make for the 03/04 cobra? or does anyone know what kind of exhaust manifolds the 00 cobra R had? they should fit...provided it's possible to get ahold of them lol

02-27-2007, 07:35 AM	#1211 (permalink)
r3dn3ck Wowbagger hates me too! Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Magrathea/California Posts: 7,018	sleeping... the heads weigh nearly double what the 2v do. Figure you'll be 200lbs heavier than stock up front. The 4v is just as tall as the 2v and there are better intakes available for 4v applications like the Reichard, Navigator, etc.. Midlength from Bassani should probably be something you can MAKE fit but they won't just out of the box... they're weld together so the special work isn't that bad. The 00'R had stock CAST IRON PI MANIFOLDS. Can you believe that crap.

02-27-2007, 09:27 AM	#1213 (permalink)
bassman97 blank Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: North Jersey Posts: 1,500	The '00 Cobra R had the PI exhaust logs!?! Imagine how power would be gained w/ FRPP 4V shortie headers. Why didn't Ford use the standard 4V manifold? Is the 2V PI version narrower or something?

02-27-2007, 09:40 AM	#1214 (permalink)
r3dn3ck Wowbagger hates me too! Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Magrathea/California Posts: 7,018	the standard 4v manifold was used... PI was a typo that made it in from another thread... my bad. Nonetheless it was the cast iron log type and they suck. the biggest reason to not use something better was space or rather a lack thereof. An old pal of mine had a 00 R that made 440rwhp with just a tune. Power gain with a shortie isn't impressive... if you can squeeze mids or long tubes in there then it starts getting interesting.

02-27-2007, 09:46 AM	#1215 (permalink)
SleepingGT Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 147	thats what i was wondering about, how difficult would it be to beat some bassani midlengths in there

02-27-2007, 10:32 AM	#1216 (permalink)
bassman97 blank Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: North Jersey Posts: 1,500	From what was said when Saleen330 was here, basically, the steering linkage got in the way. So some creativity will probably be needed to fix that problem and then they should fit. That's what since it doen't make sense to put 2V logs on a 4V head.

02-27-2007, 11:38 AM	#1217 (permalink)
r3dn3ck Wowbagger hates me too! Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Magrathea/California Posts: 7,018	or 4v logs on a 4v head...

02-27-2007, 09:19 PM	#1218 (permalink)
SleepingGT Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 147	considering i never plan on going FI, i'm considering going stroker 4v instead so i can keep my "V6" hood and use lt's anyone know the power difference between comparably modded 4.6 stroker vs 5.4 4v? both will be sprayed minimum 200 shot on forged internals or if their is a 5.4 4v intake that allows me to keep the stock hood?

02-28-2007, 07:15 AM	#1219 (permalink)
r3dn3ck Wowbagger hates me too! Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Magrathea/California Posts: 7,018	about 75hp and 100tq difference. you have a good choice of intakes. If you stick with B heads and use a 96-98 cobra intake with Reichard plates you should see really good power output even with the Reichard 4v plates in place. hood clearance is going to be something you'll have to deal with. I'd start looking at a cobra R hood just in case. I don't know anyone personally who's got a 4v 5.4 other than Al Pappito and his car is pretty custom.

02-28-2007, 07:50 AM	#1220 (permalink)
bassman97 blank Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: North Jersey Posts: 1,500	Why not go w/ the Cobra R/GT/GT500 heads? Kar Kraft has them for sale fully assembled. Ask Al if he could hook you up w/ a Cobra R intake and you'll be set. Then you're looking at a guarenteed 400 hp. However, if you don't have the money, yeah, what r3dn3ck said.

02-28-2007, 10:12 AM	#1222 (permalink)
r3dn3ck Wowbagger hates me too! Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Magrathea/California Posts: 7,018	negligable if you go by flow numbers. I recommend going with B heads so you can use some of the excellent intakes those years used. They aren't perfect by a long shot but they are very nice and flow big and they're factory ford so you shoudn't have much issue with smog techs twisting your berries over an aftermarket intake.

02-28-2007, 10:55 AM	#1223 (permalink)
stang671 Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 61	How hard is it to install the cent...SC....and which cent..is the best one for this application...and should i leave it at a shop...or should i just order it and put it in when i get back...i will try to build it to the 9 compression then run it with 14lbs and hope fully with the meth..be able to run it on pump if that lb for compression theory works...but is it hard to install a SC (cent) and a 3-core cooler...i read it takes about 5-6hrs to install....thanks for taking the time to read this...