Anyone intrested in 5.4L swaps, in here. Need you to opine.
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I know for sure you would feel that and put a smile on your face!
How much you planning on putting down? between 600-700?
i want 500-550 on the motor and blower...
if the motor makes 325hp N/A and you add a blower it takes 14.7 psi (1 bar) to basically double power, so 325 on motor @ 14#-18% drivetrain loss should net 495hp, so 16# should be 580hp...in a perfect world...
just imagine a fully forged DSS 5.4 w/ patriot stage II heads , holding a set of comp cams stage II cams xe270's, a bullitt intake, mac headers, dr gas x-pipe and 2 chamber flows.....with a D1SC putting out 14-16#'s boost and a 75 shot of the go-go juice for fun......
just imagine a fully forged DSS 5.4 w/ patriot stage II heads , holding a set of comp cams stage II cams xe270's, a bullitt intake, mac headers, dr gas x-pipe and 2 chamber flows.....with a D1SC putting out 14-16#'s boost and a 75 shot of the go-go juice for fun......
wait a minute, its gonna be a reality!!!!!!!!!!
I thought about that then i realized i don't have that kind of money. But that's awesome. Maybe after this one goes i will be able to afford that.
__________________ 03 Sonic Blue GT (SOLD) Now own a 92 GT
i don't know what mine will make but so far i have the .020" forged pistons, PI heads with comp cams, electric water pump, and all the bolt ons. so anyone what to gues what it will make after a tune? i'd like to say 300hp and close to 375tq to the wheels. but thats a guess.
i don't know what mine will make but so far i have the .020" forged pistons, PI heads with comp cams, electric water pump, and all the bolt ons. so anyone what to gues what it will make after a tune? i'd like to say 300hp and close to 375tq to the wheels. but thats a guess.
I would guess around 280 HP to the wheels, or alittle more, and the TQ sounds right.
He's got cams too which will make a big difference in power. Depending on the cams that you selected I'm predicting 300-315hp and 375tq. The major thing that holds the 5.4 back is the cams. You just can't fill those deep azz holes with stock duration.
A comp 262Ah should get you right up to around 300. The overbore is going to make cams even more useful since you're upping the quantity of air that needs to come in to fill each cylinder.
I've decided to go with flat top slugs that will sit my compression at 11:1. With 262's I'm looking for 325hp and 375-385tq on a .020 overbore.
Myillwillinc... did you order your rods? If not now is the time. Send me an email when you get a chance. I PM'd everyone that showed interest with my email and phone number. Gimme a shiznout.
Chip... at 14lbs you'll want a good set of blower cams not xe270's...need to minimize overlap, especially with supercharging + nitrous or you'll lose boost out the exhaust. As far as I can tell the 270's are a NA cam.
just a tip. The power at 16psi should land in the 600 zone with tq being considerably higher. You'll want to look seriously at a TKO600 tranny. Add nitrous and you can see 700+hp and axle snapping tq in a hurry.
That nitrous is going to act like a water/methanol cooling. A 50 shot of nitrous is going to be a very big power gain. You are talking a 75 shot and I think you will actually see closer to 100 rwhp extra with a blower.
After putting a 351W into a 67 Mustang, a combo not done in Dearborne, I have to say that would not put another tall deck in a hole not optioned by the factory again. What a pain in the arse that was!! I'll squeeze mine, or do a stroker kit first!!
__________________ 03 F250 Power Stroke 4X4
You can't choke the guy who ripped you off online!!
really... what kind of problems did you have with that?
I don't know if you've read through much of the thread but, we've seen several people finish and apart from the little things like spreading the exhaust and the hood clearance we've really seen surprisingly simple swap notes.
myillwillinc and Saleen S330 haven't complained at all about their swap experiences.
Chip... at 14lbs you'll want a good set of blower cams not xe270's...need to minimize overlap, especially with supercharging + nitrous or you'll lose boost out the exhaust. As far as I can tell the 270's are a NA cam.
just a tip. The power at 16psi should land in the 600 zone with tq being considerably higher. You'll want to look seriously at a TKO600 tranny. Add nitrous and you can see 700+hp and axle snapping tq in a hurry.
yea i know i need bigger cams to maximize the potential.....but i wanted a lil smaller cam to be more streetable and tunable.
with big cams you have either good tune and partially rough idle or good idle and partially good tune. i friend just done that with his combo: SHM 302 stroker, patriot stage 3 heads, custom grind synder .591 lift cams, p-51 intake, d1sc @ 12 #'s. it was a pain to tune it......(Jim D'Amore of JDM Engineering) tuned it
After putting a 351W into a 67 Mustang, a combo not done in Dearborne, I have to say that would not put another tall deck in a hole not optioned by the factory again. What a pain in the arse that was!! I'll squeeze mine, or do a stroker kit first!!
I did a 351C into a '66 fastback Mustang...I figure a 5.4 into a 2000 will be a piece of cake
Just wondering when everyone gets there blocks...Is one 5.4 better to get then another? Does it matter if i get one out of a 1997 Ford Van or a 2002 Ford F250 or a 2004 Lincoln Navigator? Any specific Vin's on the blocks i should look for or watch out for?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpinMedia
heres your tip of the day fellaz,
Dont ever stick your finger in a girls butt while having sex. Had a bad experience once -_-
we've covered this a few times but we'll do it once more just for you. Later is better as they added some extra meat to the block in the later production years to combat various types of wear and tear. It still doesn't really matter though. There's never been a report I've heard where the block was too weak. A 97 is fine... a 2003 is even better. A 2004 needs to have come from a navigator only as the rest of them are now 3V and they mount differently from what I understand.
I'm using a 00 block. Check out www.car-part.com. You can pick up a block for 150-300 easy. Or just call your local salvage yard.
Sean Hyland Motorsport carries a complete line of Ford factory parts for 4.6 and 5.4L engines including front covers and bolts and gaskets and all that little stuff. Call em up for a catalog. I've got one in front of me and it's been pretty useful in identifying parts that I need and about how much they'll cost.
I have read that the 2002 and newer motors are better because the 2001 and older motors had some kind of vibration or something like that but after 2001 they added more to the block to fix the problem. Not exactly sure what the problem was though.
I got my motor from a mechanics shop that had one sitting there that was supposed to be a core but was never picked up and got it for $100, the bottom end seized up but there are no holes in the block so i bought it. Still working on building it though. So if you have any friends that are mechanics let them know what you are trying to do and maybe they have one sitting in there shop. That's what i did.
__________________ 03 Sonic Blue GT (SOLD) Now own a 92 GT
He's got cams too which will make a big difference in power. Depending on the cams that you selected I'm predicting 300-315hp and 375tq. The major thing that holds the 5.4 back is the cams. You just can't fill those deep azz holes with stock duration.
A comp 262Ah should get you right up to around 300. The overbore is going to make cams even more useful since you're upping the quantity of air that needs to come in to fill each cylinder.
I've decided to go with flat top slugs that will sit my compression at 11:1. With 262's I'm looking for 325hp and 375-385tq on a .020 overbore.
Myillwillinc... did you order your rods? If not now is the time. Send me an email when you get a chance. I PM'd everyone that showed interest with my email and phone number. Gimme a shiznout.
On the 5.4 swap in the 5.0 mag, after bolt ons,CAI pulleys exhaust 70mmTB ported plenum, they gained 253 HP and 344 TQ to the wheels, with a good tune also. Then they added the crane non pi cams, the bigger for non pi, and the power went to 265 HP and 337 TQ to the wheels. TQ fell alittle. Max HP was at 4600 rpms and tQ was at 3600 rpms. With the Reichard intake they also gained over 20 HP and TQ to the wheels. They thought the cams would be the biggest restriction but found out the heads weren't keeping up. though HP peaked at 4600 rpms, the power did go up more on the top end, some places like 27 HP and 27 TQ. IF you go with some bigger cams, better plenum, i can see 280 HP, with heads, over 300 HP to the wheels.
I would have to say the restriction are, from lowest to highest is the intake, cams, then heads. If anything i would buy heads first and intake last.
With the mods that i had to do to make the 5.4 work, cake. Minimal things and totally worth the TQ.
do you know if the cam they used was a 550 lift or a 500 lift and what duration it was?
I'd imagine the extra lift from the PI cams would be worth that extra 15-20hp. the only reason I say that is that on 4.6's you can yank 300hp pretty easily with a nice moderately hot cam... something like a XE272AH and a decent porting job. With the extra vacuum signal from a 5.4 that should be easy to match without the tq losses that you see when you do that on a 4.6.
i think we need to pop for some 270AH cams for you and see what happens. how's pitchin in? I'll put 20 on it.
do you know if the cam they used was a 550 lift or a 500 lift and what duration it was?
I'd imagine the extra lift from the PI cams would be worth that extra 15-20hp. the only reason I say that is that on 4.6's you can yank 300hp pretty easily with a nice moderately hot cam... something like a XE272AH and a decent porting job. With the extra vacuum signal from a 5.4 that should be easy to match without the tq losses that you see when you do that on a 4.6.
i think we need to pop for some 270AH cams for you and see what happens. how's pitchin in? I'll put 20 on it.
They were .500", I would think the .550 will do some good. I wish everyone would pich in for the 270's!! What do you think about PTV clearances?
I've heard some good stories and bad stories with the 270's, heck even comp cams told me not to buy them unless i notch my pistons or to stick to the .500, but it sucks when you buy heads and the springs are good up to .600
I'm still going to Pro-Dyno on june 16th to have it dyno-tuned and i can post some numbers so we sorta have a starting point on some power and TQ these bad boys make.
Also to show the 5.4 is worth swapping to!!!
I'm still going to Pro-Dyno on june 16th to have it dyno-tuned and i can post some numbers so we sorta have a starting point on some power and TQ these bad boys make.
Also to show the 5.4 is worth swapping to!!!
That sounds great, and you have a very streetable setup as well. Have you had any drivability problems, besides tune and traction loss?
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97 Triple Black Cobra Convertible
That sounds great, and you have a very streetable setup as well. Have you had any drivability problems, besides tune and traction loss?
Nothing yet, knock on wood...I drive it 3 times a week, and i've drove it to darlington which is an hour away. the top down, and easy power with just a push of the pedal. 5th gear acceleration is really great, it's nice not having to downshift to 4th to pass someone.
Also i calculated that i get 24 mpg, that's way better than the 4.6 that i had. In the 5.0 mag, i think they said theirs got 23 mpg
Why wouldn't we be able to use the DOHC intake that Sullivan Performance makes for the 5.4? Is it that the ports are just shaped differently? Couldn't we modify the heads to work with them? The intake is still kind of pricey but not too bad.
Do you know r3dn3ck?
Also Sullivan performance makes the intakes that you can run a carburator on 4.6 and 5.4 DOHC motors so if someone wanted the DOHC and didn't mind having it carburatored it would be alot easier than swaping computers and wiring crap.
__________________ 03 Sonic Blue GT (SOLD) Now own a 92 GT
DOHC intakes are MUCH skinnier than SOHC intakes so it wouldn't even reach the heads. A sullivan type for SOHC would move the power band out a little and pick up HP (5.0 mag did test one) but it's a waste really to spend that much for an intake when the heads can't flow enough to match the potential. Cam it, port it and take what you get. It's still mid 12's on 87 octane. If you want an intake wait for the HPS Hardball'r for 4.6 and use plates or wait a few more months for the 5.4L purpose built mustang intake. It might even fit under the stock hood without any surgery to the underside.
The 550 lift is stock PI lift but, from what I read the NPI flow better from 500 lift upwards anyway. In any case the PI heads have bigger valves and they flow better where we want it... everywhere under 500 which is where the valve spends most of it's open time. I'm getting 262's so I don't have to go back to stock to pass the sniffer test come smog time (in 2 more years). The .600 lift springs are still a good idea though if you want to spin more RPM and you've built the bottom end with stronger rods to handle it. With my H-beams and 262's I want to be able to spin the 5.4 to 6500rpm without floating a valve so I don't have to worry about over revving if I break the tires loose on a nitrous run and can't get out of the gas quick enough. The 270's and up have been notorious for PTV issues on PI motors but I haven't heard many at all from NPI guys. So either NPI aren't doing many cam swaps or they're really happy with their 270H's and PTV isn't a problem. We know it is for PI motors so that kinda limits us to 262AH and 268AH
270's are probably a little much anyway.. 262's or 268's seem more street oriented to me. I'll probably have my pistons notched anyway since they won't be in the motor for a little bit yet and I'm buying flat tops.
A carb'd modular motor is just a sin. There's also the issue of a distributor... modulars don't have them so you have to rig up the crank trigger to some kind of aftermarket ignition system. That's just too much work for this lazy ol' boy.
on the gas mileage... with all that tq on tap you don't need to feed it HP. Since HP is a directly relative product of how much fuel you change into air, using less HP to do anything will take less gas.
Saleen has 373's too. I'm sticking with my 3.27's so I can have a little more traction at low speeds so I'll be hoping for 23-27mpg. When my car was new it got 27-29 highway and about 13-17 city. Now it's less but I drive faster too. If figure my 4.6 gives me about 8-13mpg on my commute to work so the 5.4 can't do much worse.
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